How Many Round Trips Can a Team Make?

[KrazyCarl92]

Unless a team plans on relying on others dropping game pieces, it will be necessary to go all the way across the field to get pieces from the HPs and then go all the way back over to score them at the alliance wall. So how many times do you think teams will be able to go back and forth to complete a round trip during a match???

My guess is 5 in a two minute practice period, but in-game I think 3 would be most realistic and 4 would be and good match.

My reason being about 10 fps on average so about 6 seconds for going across the field each way(12).

Then it will never be a straight shot b/c you go from center to corner and back. So I estimate an extra 5 seconds total (5).

Then a team must retrieve the game pieces and probably possess them somehow, 3 seconds a rough average, maybe 1 for those elite teams (3)?

Then teams must also place the pieces which I could see the elite teams doing in 2 seconds, but the average being about 7, but the extra time can be built into other teams trying to pin the elite teams (7).

12 + 5 + 3 + 7 = 27 seconds for a trip...

which works out to 4 remainder 12 seconds left. So if we consider an elite team and they have a great match, I'd say 4 and then time for Minibot action (if that is their strategy). Although I think most teams will land in either 3 trips in a good match, 2 in a poor/well defended match, and many may find themselves making tradeoffs to either complete a logo or go for the minibot at the very end.

Of course, this time-task analysis is all considering that other teams aren't conveniently dropping tubes, but it can reveal a lot about what an individual robot can realistically accomplish on its own in a single teleop. Or maybe that a viable strategy is to have one robot shuttle/ferry pieces from the feeder to the alliance zone to facilitate "hangers".

[ATannahill]

I would say at most 18, since thats how many game pieces there are.

You also have to remember that Woodie said (and the manual confirmed) game pieces can be thrown over the driver station wall.

[Grim Tuesday]

You also discount defenders, and robots that are capable of "throwing" pieces.

[Erik Huang]

if the pieces are thrown however, what stops the other alliance from stealing them? and if you plan on throwing them onto the robot somehow, don't forget that pool tubes aren't exactly aerodynamic, are they?

[1168Programmer]

Originally Posted by Erik Huang

if the pieces are thrown however, what stops the other alliance from stealing them? and if you plan on throwing them onto the robot somehow, don't forget that pool tubes aren't exactly aerodynamic, are they?

Yeah, they'll just float down to sit basically in the other alliance's scoring zone. Unless you can find a way to almost frisbee-throw them into the middle of the field, where it would be a free-for-all to take them...

Out of curiousity, what happens if two robots grab the same game piece at the same time?

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by 1168Programmer

Yeah, they'll just float down to sit basically in the other alliance's scoring zone. Unless you can find a way to almost frisbee-throw them into the middle of the field, where it would be a free-for-all to take them...

I'm going to guess you weren't around for the 2007 game. It is possible to throw a round intertube pretty far reliably, I know our human player threw at least 1 onto the rack and if I recall correctly at least 1 if not more into an opponents zone.

[1168Programmer]

Wouldn't the opponent alliance's scoring rack get in the way though? Unless people are really good at throwing over the wall and avoid hitting the scoring racks and poles...

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by 1168Programmer

Wouldn't the opponent alliance's scoring rack get in the way though? Unless people are really good at throwing over the wall and avoid hitting the scoring racks and poles...

That is a good point and may be true. My biggest point is to be careful with assumptions.

[MagiChau]

Originally Posted by Erik Huang

if the pieces are thrown however, what stops the other alliance from stealing them? and if you plan on throwing them onto the robot somehow, don't forget that pool tubes aren't exactly aerodynamic, are they?

I believe the drivers and feeders must know their abilities alongside with the robots and develop a strategy (to be able to predict what tube to prepare usually) so it is possible, kind of like American football, to "catch" a pass and eliminate possibility of an interception.

[1168Programmer]

It seems that if you want to throw you will probably have to practice throwing the tubes prior to the competitions...

[MagiChau]

To me it seems more optimal to have 2 shuttles, assuming the robot will be fast enough that it can evade a single robot, then if you are double teamed there would be another shuttle to run pieces to the hanger.

I am confident this will get in at least I don't know 5-6 trips in? Maybe 9 if its a good game.

[Cyberphil]

Lets see:

At our max speed of 16 fps, so 3.75s across the field ideally (Using 60 feet across the field)

Plus interaction with other robots (probably 5 seconds on average)

Plus picking up the game piece (4 realistically)

Plus Driving back

Plus Placing the piece (Hopefully 3 sec?)

Does 24 seconds sound good? These are realistic, average values also. Nothing for best and worst match yet...

[Grim Tuesday]

What we need to figure out is how much interference a defending robot can create. If its around 5 seconds each one way, then that lowers a robot's efficiency by almost 30%.

[GBIT]

As posted on my teams forums earlier by a team member:


A few thoughts:

To get a perfect score, each team on the alliance would need to get and place a tube every 18 seconds (assuming 15 seconds at the end for minibot missions).

If you look at each robot placing a tube every 29 seconds, the best raw score is a 28 (6 hi, 5 medium)

In our human player simulations, the best match we turned in was 9 tubes. ( 9 tubes is each alliance robot placing a tube every 35 seconds). The best raw score for 9 tubes is 24 (6 hi, 3 medium).

If we can't do a high placement, the best score we can achieve in teleop mode with 9 tubes is 15 (6 med, 3 lo). This is the same score as placing 5 tubes, all hi. at 63 seconds per tube.

[Al Skierkiewicz]

Human players can throw over the player station.
<G57> During the TELEOPERATED PERIOD, FEEDERS may enter LOGO PIECES onto the FIELD by using the FEEDING SLOTS or by throwing the LOGO PIECE over the top of the FEEDER STATION wall. LOGO PIECES may not be thrown around the side of the FEEDER STATION wall. Violation: PENALTY