Deciding which bridge to go for

[ToddF]

Here is a fun question. In the endgame, you have a choice of two bridges to head for: your own, and the coopertition bridge. Which one should be your priority? How does the number of robots left operating on each side effect your decision? Does the point spread effect your decision? How about the relative rankings of the teams?

At our first glance, it appears that the first priority should always be to go for the cooperition bridge, but we haven't done an in-depth look yet. (One definite exception would be if there are no operating robots left on the other side of the field.)

[nighterfighter]

Go for the one that makes you win.

You get 2 QS points for winning.
0 for losing.

If a robot from each alliance is on the cooperation bridge, you get an additional 2 QS points.

I'd focus more on ensuring that you will win the match.

[KrazyCarl92]

But the other side of the argument is that if you and a team on the other alliance feel like you have a good chance to get the coopertition bonus, you get 2 points for that and 0 points for not getting it, regardless of whether or not you win. That's just as important...

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by KrazyCarl92

But the other side of the argument is that if you and a team on the other alliance feel like you have a good chance to get the coopertition bonus, you get 2 points for that and 0 points for not getting it, regardless of whether or not you win. That's just as important...

So, a basically guaranteed 2 points if you can get on your own bridge, or possibly 2 points if you manage to balance with an opposing robot, with no communication.

[KrazyCarl92]

Originally Posted by nighterfighter

So, a basically guaranteed 2 points if you can get on your own bridge, or possibly 2 points if you manage to balance with an opposing robot, with no communication.

How would that be a guaranteed 2 points for getting on your own bridge? You could still lose the match. Plus, you could win the match AND get the coopertition bonus; that's 4 points.

[Ninja_Bait]

There is a definite need for collusion between opposing alliances in qualifying matches. No one will want to pass up the extra 2 CP.

[Hallry]

Originally Posted by Ninja_Bait

There is a definite need for collusion between opposing alliances in qualifying matches. No one will want to pass up the extra 2 CP.

Completely agree, this will be huge in competition.

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by KrazyCarl92

How would that be a guaranteed 2 points for getting on your own bridge? You could still lose the match. Plus, you could win the match AND get the coopertition bonus; that's 4 points.

Well, the bonus you get for just having 2 of your robots on your bridge is 20 points, which is a HUGE point bonus. Depending on how many balls your opponents have scored, (20 points is anywhere from 7 to 20 goals...) it can almost be a guaranteed win.

Granted, getting your 3rd robot to go for the coopertition bonus isn't a bad idea.

[KrazyCarl92]

Originally Posted by nighterfighter

Well, the bonus you get for just having 2 of your robots on your bridge is 20 points, which is a HUGE point bonus. Depending on how many balls your opponents have scored, (20 points is anywhere from 7 to 20 goals...) it can almost be a guaranteed win.

Granted, getting your 3rd robot to go for the coopertition bonus isn't a bad idea.

But if a robot on your alliance and a robot on the opposing alliance can both go up on the bridges, then choosing to go for the coopertition bonus instead of independently scoring would mean 10 poinrs less for each alliance. This means it would be a wash in terms of point, net point differential change of 0. But both alliances stand to gain in doing this by taking the coopertition bonus.

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by KrazyCarl92

But if a robot on your alliance and a robot on the opposing alliance can both go up on the bridges, then choosing to go for the coopertition bonus instead of independently scoring would mean 10 poinrs less for each alliance. This means it would be a wash in terms of point, net point differential change of 0. But both alliances stand to gain in doing this by taking the coopertition bonus.

1 Robot on your bridge = 10 Points
2 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points
3 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points (For Qual. matches)

Having 2 go up is best, then get your 3rd one to go for the coopertition.

[Hallry]

Originally Posted by nighterfighter

1 Robot on your bridge = 10 Points
2 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points
3 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points (For Qual. matches)

Having 2 go up is best, then get your 3rd one to go for the coopertition.

Completely true, but definitely go for 3 on your alliance bridge during Eliminations.

In Elims:
1 Robot on your bridge = 10 Points
2 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points
3 Robots on your bridge = 40 Points

So 3 robots on your alliance's bridge would equal TWICE as much as 2 during Elimination matches, where Qualifying points from the Coopertition bridge would no longer matter.

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by Hallry

Completely true, but definitely go for 3 on your alliance bridge during Eliminations.

In Elims:
1 Robot on your bridge = 10 Points
2 Robots on your bridge = 20 Points
3 Robots on your bridge = 40 Points

So 3 robots on your alliance's bridge would equal TWICE as much as 2 during Elimination matches, where Qualifying points from the Coopertition bridge would no longer matter.

Yup. Of course on the other hand, trying to get all 3 on your bridge might be risky. Would hate to see one of them push the other 2 off or something...

[KrazyCarl92]

Originally Posted by nighterfighter

Having 2 go up is best, then get your 3rd one to go for the coopertition.

I disagree.

Case 1. Your suggestion:

Other alliance: 2 robots on their bridge. 20 points.
Our alliance: 2 robots on our bridge. 20 points.
No coopertition bonus.


Case 2. My suggestion:

Other alliance: 1 robot on their bridge, one on coopertition bridge. 10 points.
Our allaince: 1 robot on our bridge, one on coopertition bridge. 10 points.
2 Coopertition bonus points.

Either way it wouldn't affect the match outcome (win/loss), but ALL teams involved benefit from a coopertition bonus. This result is repeatable and consistent in all scenarios. Since the end all be all for ranking is the qualification score, Case 2 always comes out on top by this numerical analysis.

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by KrazyCarl92

I disagree.

Case 1. Your suggestion:

Other alliance: 2 robots on their bridge. 20 points.
Our alliance: 2 robots on our bridge. 20 points.
No coopertition bonus.


Case 2. My suggestion:

Other alliance: 1 robot on their bridge, one on coopertition bridge. 10 points.
Our allaince: 1 robot on our bridge, one on coopertition bridge. 10 points.
2 Coopertition bonus points.

Either way it wouldn't affect the match outcome (win/loss), but ALL teams involved benefit from a coopertition bonus. This result is repeatable and consistent in all scenarios. Since the end all be all for ranking is the qualification score, Case 2 always comes out on top by this numerical analysis.

I think we have a misunderstanding...

In your scenario #2 there are 3 robots not on a bridge.

I am saying that you have 2 of your 3 alliance robots go for YOUR bridge to get 20 points. Then make your 3rd one go for the coopertition.

[Bill_B]

What percentage of robots will have the ability to climb on a bridge? As noted elsewhere, the bridges will not stay tilted for access by themselves. This means if you intend to get onto a bridge, your robot has to be designed for it. It will take good choreography to depend on an alliance partner already on a bridge to allow other alliance robots to join them there.