A plea for a quieter pit area

[Aren_Hill]

Had a safety inspector tell us to be quite vocal when moving the robot at midwest...

[sanddrag]

I see it as a safety hazard more than a safety practice. Here's why.

The problem I see is that it's being yelled so often, and so many times without purpose, that two things are happening:

1. People hear it so often they are tuning it out. It has less meaning now. It's like the boy who cried wolf.
2. Teams are gaining a false sense of entitlement that just because they yell "ROBOT!", other people will immediately move out of their way, and they proceed forward quickly whether the path is clear or not.

[wilsonmw04]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

I see it as a safety hazard more than a safety practice. Here's why.

The problem I see is that it's being yelled so often, and so many times without purpose, that two things are happening:

1. People hear it so often they are tuning it out. It has less meaning now. It's like the boy who cried wolf.

couldn't that be said for any noise making safety device (horns, sirens or what not)? By your logic, anything that makes noise or flashes a light on a regular basis is a safety hazard.

Safety experts are telling us to do it. I'm not sure why this practice is a bad thing. It's might be a tad annoying for some, but I'd rather have a few rolled eyes in my general direction than having to pull someone off the floor because they just ran into my team's robot on the way to queuing.

[Carolyn_Grace]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

couldn't that be said for any noise making safety device (horns, sirens or what not)? By your logic, anything that makes noise or flashes a light on a regular basis is a safety hazard.

Safety experts are telling us to do it. I'm not sure why this practice is a bad thing. It's might be a tad annoying for some, but I'd rather have a few rolled eyes in my general direction than having to pull someone off the floor because they just ran into my team's robot on the way to queuing.

I disagree with your logic here. Noise making safety devices are often designed to emit an irritating noise that you can't ignore. Whereas, a regular human voice yelling the same word over and over again can become something that you just don't notice after a while...it just becomes part of the "white noise" around you.

Also, a noisemaker doesn't go off every ten seconds, to a point where you can start ignoring it. Usually when a safety alarm goes off, it's not something that you are used to. Like fire alarms, tornado warnings, a truck backing up...it is an out of the ordinary noise. But when someone yells "Robot, Robot, ROBOT" over and over again, it becomes an ordinary noise, something that you stop noticing.

The safety advisors are only human. And in my experience they often are not correct on some of the "Safe Methods" that they tell teams to follow. For example: telling our team that it's not safe to have sandwich wrappers on our toolbox and not allowing there to be bottled water in the pit area because it could cause a fire if spilled on a robot. (Hello, Disney Championship days of robots getting RAINED on).

I don't think the point of yelling "ROBOT" is to keep people from running in to robots...robots are pretty big and hard to miss. I think people are yelling "ROBOT" is so that they can push their way through people blocking their paths. What this thread is trying to point out is that it is much more effective to have someone walk in front of your robot and *politely* ask nicely, "Excuse me, may we get by with our robot?" Or "Excuse me, we have to get to our match."

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Carolyn_Grace

Also, a noisemaker doesn't go off every ten seconds, to a point where you can start ignoring it.

By the 3rd day of competition, a quieter voice can often gain more attention than a loud obnoxious one.

I saw far more dangerous set-ups for the robot traffic incurred by the guests than I did by the robots on their way to queuing. My question is, why do the competitors have to contend with this? If baby strollers are not allowed in the pits, then why do the guests with baby strollers take up valuable time arguing with the safety advisor when told to move out of the way of the lane of robot traffic immediately and remove the baby stroller from the pits? Why does everyone have to be involved in unsnarling constant tangles in the lane? Which is what it should be - a robot traffic lane. No more, no less.

It's a dumb waste of time and energy that could be managed so easily.

Jane

P.S. Here's my thinking on guests. They can be welcomed in the pits but they have to have an understanding of what that means. Scenario: new mentors with new families - how much prior training/understanding of the competition pits has been given to the mentors so that they can share that understanding/information with the families? Parents/relatives/friends of students and mentors on the team - same thing. How much training and information has been given to the guests so that they understand the value, importance, and reasons for the pits' existence? Many relatives, etc., are used to things like science fairs and museums, where they are free to roam and not be an obstruction in anyone's path. No one likes to be told to get out of the way or to leave the pits or to MOVE! No one likes feeling stupid or that they are in the way or that their shoes are bad. How much effort on the part of each team would it take to kick the training/flow of information up a notch? It could start with visits to the team's build session, teaching the guests how students and mentors conduct themselves in the shop and why that is important. If leaflets are to be handed out, they should be handed out there - explaining the reason for safety glasses, hair pulled back, and closed shoes. It could also be helpful if guests are given the information containing the team name, number, and where they are from - not just: 'come to the competition on Saturday - it's cool.'

Venues could scale back on times that the pits are open to the guests and the teams could have ambassadors to help with the guests/flow of traffic, etc. Lanes could be identified with tape on the floor. Teams are very good at following tape lines and guests could learn to respect those tape lines.

Nobody has to be the bad guy and get yelled at - constantly.

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by wilsonmw04

couldn't that be said for any noise making safety device (horns, sirens or what not)?

The police don't run their siren every time they are moving. The backup beeper on the garbage truck only sounds when the vehicle is backing. If those warnings were continual, people would begin to ignore them too.

People yelling ROBOT constantly makes it just blend in with all the other noise.

[Vikesrock]

Originally Posted by Carolyn_Grace

I don't think the point of yelling "ROBOT" is to keep people from running in to robots...robots are pretty big and hard to miss. I think people are yelling "ROBOT" is so that they can push their way through people blocking their paths. What this thread is trying to point out is that it is much more effective to have someone walk in front of your robot and *politely* ask nicely, "Excuse me, may we get by with our robot?" Or "Excuse me, we have to get to our match."

Exactly. "Excuse us, robot coming through please" worked quite well for us at Peachtree on the occasions the path was not clear and sounded much better than the wail of "ROBOT" that our safety captain was instructed to use.

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

People yelling ROBOT constantly makes it just blend in with all the other noise.

I would think they would want to look at ways to lower unnecessary noise/levels.

Jane

[Boydean]

I can tell you that over the years I've become numb to the yelling of "ROBOT". Its just something I expect to hear when entering the pits.

I think the core issue here is not the noise of yelling "ROBOT!" (although that still is an issue), but the fact that there are so many people standing in the middle of aisles without any thought as what their doing. I find it incredible dangerous when we have guests and even team member basically loitering in aisles for no good reason. I realize that teams need to meet with each other between matches, and guests come to visit teams at competition, but is it really necessarily to have 15+ people in your pit at one time?

I believe that if we try harder to decrease the overall amount of people in the pit area then the need to scream warnings will noticeably decrease.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Aren_Hill

Had a safety inspector tell us to be quite vocal when moving the robot at midwest...

Midwest's pits were insanely tight. 2410's pit was nearly in the queing line and I am so very glad that such a well organized and professional team like them were there. They kept their pits clean and organized and out of the queing area and even helped keep it the queing area clean. It made my job much easier!

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

I see it as a safety hazard more than a safety practice. Here's why.

The problem I see is that it's being yelled so often, and so many times without purpose, that two things are happening:

1. People hear it so often they are tuning it out. It has less meaning now. It's like the boy who cried wolf.
2. Teams are gaining a false sense of entitlement that just because they yell "ROBOT!", other people will immediately move out of their way, and they proceed forward quickly whether the path is clear or not.

I agree wholeheartedly particularly with point #2. I've seen and been the recipient of a collision with a robot cart because someone has taken the attitude that because they yelled robot at the top of their lungs they are not responsible for running into people.

In regards to point #1 the fact that people yell it at the top of their lungs means that it is ineffective. There really isn't a way to determine if it is coming from 2 isles over from someone yelling at the top of their lungs or someone using a reasonably loud voice coming down your isle.

In regards to those who say the access to the pits should be restricted I just don't agree as that goes against the goals of first. Sure it is good to see the matches but getting up close and personal with the robots in the pits and seeing older kids putting so much effort into working on their robots is much more effective at sparking an interest in future generations of FIRST'ers.

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Mr V

In regards to those who say the access to the pits should be restricted I just don't agree as that goes against the goals of first. Sure it is good to see the matches but getting up close and personal with the robots in the pits and seeing older kids putting so much effort into working on their robots is much more effective at sparking an interest in future generations of FIRST'ers.

It could be more controlled. I've been to regionals where middle schools (leaning on the younger side) were bussed in on Friday and basically, turned loose with very few chaperones/teachers in attendance. Sorry - the pit area is not a place for babysitting the future generation.

I've also had the displeasure of approaching a young family: father holding the hand of a 4 year old, mother holding a newborn - and telling all of them that they needed safety glasses, covered shoes, and by the time I got to the stroller, the mother (almost in tears) tucked her head and said, "we'll just leave," and made arrangements for her husband to take the young son on a stroll through the pits. That was ghastly. Awful. That family should have been able to experience a tour of the pits with joy and with someone to guide them through the experience.

These are just two examples of many that I've seen/had to contend with as a volunteer. Not fun for anyone.

There is always room for improvement and creating opportunities for more order in the pits that allows for deeper understanding of what they are and what they achieve is a good thing not a bad thing.

Jane

[fuzzwaz]

You know, I thought this was just me. Last year I really didn’t notice, but this past weekend at the Nile's District I was getting kind of irritated by hearing “Robot” all the time.

I think it has to do with the fact that last year I was a human player and I was always moving in and out of the pits, but when you actually stay in the pits for a long period of time... It can get out of hand.

I support this completely.

[Clayton Yocom]

Team 45 and a few other teams at the rear of the Pit area at the Midwest Regional asked the Pit announcer to yell slightly quieter into the mic so that you could actually hear people that were 2 feet away from you. (I personally had to stop talking every time the announcer spoke as I was talking to judges or pit scouters) He accepted and was quieter for about 2 hrs, but rose his volume again as the DJ turned the music up insanely loud. Midwest had the volume very good during Thurs/Beginning of Friday, so that You couldn't hear the pit announcer while watching the field, and you couldn't hear the field music while in the pits. Late Friday early Saturday it got much worse. Another thing I noted is that during elims crates started moving in and teams started packing up. This would be fine if there weren't a dozen or so people in the walkways making transporting robots almost impossible.

[Aren_Hill]

Also being inside of a crate strapping the robot in while the DJ is blaring some song with insane base = oh the reverberation