Go to Post Im ready for anything. - davidthefat [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Technical > Technical Discussion
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Closed Thread
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #31   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 04-05-2011, 23:40
Kusha's Avatar
Kusha Kusha is offline
Crimpin' ain't easy
AKA: Kusha Gharahi
no team (Looking for a team)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2010
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 207
Kusha is a jewel in the roughKusha is a jewel in the roughKusha is a jewel in the roughKusha is a jewel in the rough
Re: Lignin fiber matrix (wood) as a chassis material

There was one team at the dallas regional that had a completely wooden arm. needless to say it won an award.

Hung tubes beautifully.
  #32   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-05-2011, 00:13
Happy Birthday! Ian Curtis Ian Curtis is offline
Best Available Data
FRC #1778 (Chill Out!)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Puget Sound
Posts: 2,521
Ian Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond reputeIan Curtis has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Lignin fiber matrix (wood) as a chassis material

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tristan Lall View Post
There's always an exception...I have.
[snip]
I should know better than to speak in absolutes.

More on topic, the Riot Crew (58) has built wooden robots for many years. In recent years they've used a kitbot chassis with a mostly wooden super structure, and have been very successful (but as a 1 regional/year team, no one knows of them outside of Manchester).
__________________
CHILL OUT! | Aero Stability & Control Engineer
Adam Savage's Obsessions (TED Talk) (Part 2)
It is much easier to call someone else a genius than admit to yourself that you are lazy. - Dave Gingery
  #33   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-05-2011, 00:22
three_d_dave
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Lignin fiber matrix (wood) as a chassis material

Given the interest in various materials and their suitability, it seems odd to skip over what they are suitable for.

For items that are subject to purely tensile loads, it is desirable to have a material with a high strength to density ratio. It turns out that for common steels and aluminums these are almost the same. If the stretchiness (elasticity) is important, again common steels and aluminums are most the same.

Titanium is sometimes held as a miracle material, but its claim to fame is that its density is about that of aluminum with a strength close to that of steel. Check matweb to see if I got that straight. It's other nicety is that it does not lose strength as drastically as other materials do at higher temperatures.

If steel and aluminum are so similar why the preponderance of aluminum in aircraft?

The first good reason is that aluminum oxidizes so fast and the oxide sticks so well that further corrosion of the metal requires special circumstances - like a nearly closed lap joint with some salt and water. Common steels are either corrosion resistant and relatively weak or strong and tend to develop a flaky rust that does not protect against more rust.

The second good reason is based on this - roughly speaking, the resistance to bending of a flat piece of material is proportional to the cube of its thickness. A piece of aluminum 2 inches thick will deflect 1/8th as much as a piece one inch thick. Aluminum is about 1/3 the density of steel, so an aluminum part can be 3 times thicker for the same weight. It should deflect (1/3)^3 or 1/27th as much

Unfortunately, aluminum is 3 times as elastic as steel. so, in bending, the double thickness of aluminum is only 9 times as stiff as the same weight of steel.

One of the most important tasks a wing skin has is to not wrinkle. One of the best ways to not wrinkle is to have increased bending stiffness.

A similar effect is true when it comes to wood. Its low density can offset its low strength by allowing more thickness for a similar weight. Wood is more complicated because the strength depends on the direction of the load relative to the grain, but its properties in this regard is one of the reasons trees seem to have favored wood, rather than metal. Wood is also much better at avoiding fatigue cracking, a continuous menace in the world of metals.

Additionally, even though wood is combustible, a large wood beam in a building fire is a much safer beam because wood doesn't soften in the heat. The amount of beam remaining is a decent estimator of the amount of strength remaining. That said, fire in not a part of FIRST.

Remember - the largest wingspan aircraft built was built of wood. Yes the A380 wins on some scores, but not all. see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Giant_planes_comparison.svg. Wood construction costs more and, while metal corrodes, wood can rot. Ask Knute Rockne about that.

Some of the most advanced materials today are fibers held together with resins, already mentioned as the way wood is built.
  #34   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-05-2011, 00:46
Gardner C's Avatar
Gardner C Gardner C is offline
Robotic and Drone Team Mentor
AKA: Gardner Chambliss
FRC #1648 (Grady Gear Box Ganstaz)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: May 2011
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 10
Gardner C is a jewel in the roughGardner C is a jewel in the roughGardner C is a jewel in the rough
Re: Lignin fiber matrix (wood) as a chassis material

I sorry the STL judges were not impressed. I was your inspector at Peachtree and I was very impressed. You had one if not the best designed and it was very well executed. Your robots bordered on being elegant.

I talked today to one the inspectors at STL and he was of the same impression.

You robot has also made us question our entire design approach. We are currently working on designs using both plywood and a wood truss with gussets. Think DeHaviland Mosquito, Bellanca and Morgan. We also are on the fourth version of a wooden wheel with pneumatic tires.

Thanks for the inspiration.
  #35   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-05-2011, 11:47
dez250 dez250 is offline
54... What a good number!
no team
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Rookie Year: 2000
Location: Upstate NY / Manchester, NH
Posts: 1,721
dez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond reputedez250 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to dez250
Re: Lignin fiber matrix (wood) as a chassis material

FRC 195 has made beautiful, competitive, and winning wooden chassis' as far back as I remember.

__________________
#5

-Michael Dessingue
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 14:38.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi