Legality of CADing components before build season?

[Joe G.]

Originally Posted by lemiant

I know that it is lawyering, but I thought I'd point out that since we don't have the 2012 manual now; unless FIRST tells us not to create designs NOW, then they cannot reasonably expect not to use what we will have created when they release the rule prohibiting it in 6 months

The choice to use what was created/CADded is still being made during build season, after the release of the 2012 rules.

I wouldn't bet on this rule going away anytime soon. Build and CAD all you want, it's a good learning experience, but don't expect to be allowed to use it.

[Tristan Lall]

My take on this is that because the 2011 (and previous) rules are very non-specific about what is meant by final design (nor has FIRST offered much in the way of clarification through official channels), and because it's very hard to find out about the design process unless described by a team member, that clause is nearly unenforceable.

Besides, one could think of all sorts of creative rationalizations: "We changed from 32X M4 machine screws to 16X M4 socket head cap screws; that constitutes a redesign in terms of load path and mass with the intent of putting us under the design weight while still maintaining strength. This is a redesign conducted during the build season of a prototype robot assembly from the preseason. Now we can use that improved robot design [but not preseason parts] in competition." Such a minor redesign and associated explanation is probably not what FIRST intended. But the team is saying all the right things, and the officials must be very cautions making judgments without strong support from the rulebook, especially when clearly and substantially to the detriment of a team. I think the correct call in this case is to permit it, even if you have a strong suspicion they were deliberately making a minor pro forma change to comply with the letter of the rules, irrespective of the spirit.

I'd also disagree that the 2011 rules are in effect. I would consider rules to only be enforceable by competition officials, at official events. With none remaining in the 2011 season, I don't think anybody needs to worry about running afoul of them.

Of course there's a significant chance that the 2012 rules will be similar—and given that there are plenty of 2012 events coming up, you wouldn't want to do anything now that could be enforced against you later on (e.g. if a rule talks about the preseason). And yes, since we haven't seen the 2012 rules yet, we don't actually know whether they'll succumb to the rivet lobby's machinations and ban threaded fasteners. Teams can only speculate, and hope they don't get screwed.