What Is Your Favorite Part Of FRC?

[Chris is me]

I guess what I'm trying to say is why should your team care what we think is the best part of FRC?

[AdamHeard]

What offseason?

[davidthefat]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

What offseason?

What ever you do during off season, including the IRI and other off season competitions. Or if your team does any development and out reach stuff.

[bam-bam]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

What ever you do during off season, including the IRI and other off season competitions. Or if your team does any development and out reach stuff.

#sarcasm

[EricH]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

What ever you do during off season, including the IRI and other off season competitions. Or if your team does any development and out reach stuff.

Oh, you mean that less competitive and more developmental part of the season? That's what you call it?

In this case, being vague about the difference of opinion resulted in a distinct lack of clarity about anything except that there was a difference of opinion. A little bit more about what the difference of opinion is about would probably be helpful.



P.S. The term "conflict of interest" is usually used when someone in a position to make or influence a decision stands to gain extra benefit by making a decision in favor of a particular group. Say, for example, when a judge is on a case where they own stock in a corporation involved in the case--though usually the judge recuses himself from that case in that situation.

[davidthefat]

I guess I'll write it here:
Well, I am on a campaign within my team to start running the team more like a company. We are not so high budget, we start from scratch or in debt every year and it really worries me. The year before (break away) we almost could not even participate due to bad financial planning. There is a majority in the group that want to sacrifice a well performing robot in lieu of going to a second regional. Keep in mind, last year was the only year we went to a second regional due to private donations. It was great, but I am looking ahead and thinking of sustaining our team. However, those particularly in non technical groups, want to go to a second regional. I don't blame them. But that second regional burned through half our budget last year and we started this year $400 in debt. This really worries me. But good thing is that we got aggressive on sponsoring and fundraising this year.

You can infer a lot from this. This is my last year, I wish to leave a legacy that would allow the team to sustain for a couple years longer, but I am faced with a great opposition. Especially with all the technical members graduated, except for programmers, no one can make a robot on our team. They see doing research and development during the off season a waste of money. I see it as essential. R&D actually costs a fifth of what a second regional would be (Including lodging, food and ect) I would like to have the kids start out next year with a couple thousand dollars in the bank with a database of different drive trains and code to go along with it since I won't be able to mentor.

So the bottom line is I would like to design and develop drive systems during the off season. That would allow us to be more competitive during competition, allow us more time to debug the drive code (majority of time consisted of this), let the drivers practice, build a practice bot, leave behind a legacy of CAD and code for the next years and to train rookies in skills that go into building a robot.

[Akash Rastogi]

If I had to and I mean HAD TO, choose between a second regional or designing and prototyping before build season, I would choose prototyping. It would cost less to prototype systems you want to learn about than it would to attend a second regional, and the return on investment is potentially greater.

That is why my favorite part of FRC is the "offseason."

In the end, at least you know you need to fundraise more. The money you save from not attending a second regional can also be used to compete in offseason events (many more of them). So yeah, if given the option, I would focus on how to make my robot more competitive. Perhaps your team really needs to lay out a financial/sustainability plan for the future. You never want to be in the position that you win a regional or somehow qualify for championships, but can't afford to go because you spent up your money during the pre-season.

More money = more fun, but it doesn't always = better robot.

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

If I had to and I mean HAD TO, choose between a second regional or designing and prototyping before build season, I would choose prototyping. It would cost less to prototype systems you want to learn about than it would to attend a second regional, and the return on investment is potentially greater.

I have to respectfully disagree. The second event is more or less essential to our program. You really need that quick turnaround iteration cycle to inspire kids with hard work.

[davidthefat]

Keep in mind, I do not have any real "power" bestowed upon me, but I do have a great deal of influence. I have watched ebarker's video, it is a great one and I think everyone should watch it. School starts in 3 days, so I better talk to my mentor. I do observe a great deal of things and I do analyze every aspect of a system. What I think the problem in our team is the lack of unity; we do not have a defined goal. Some kids are in it for the brownie points for college, some are in it for the fun, some want to just build robots, some are in it because they support FIRST's mission and others are in it for the competition. I need to unite the team under one goal.

[Joe G.]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

What I think the problem in our team is the lack of unity; we do not have a defined goal. Some kids are in it for the brownie points for college, some are in it for the fun, some want to just build robots, some are in it because they support FIRST's mission and others are in it for the competition. I need to unite the team under one goal.

While a general common purpose is good, remember that diversity is a virtue. As long as you can get them all to work hard, people with diverse reasons for doing FIRST will do diverse things within the team, leading to a stronger team overall. There's a fine line between working towards the same goal, and forcing conformity. Remember that you're in a program with a lot of turnover, which people enter for extremely diverse reasons.


As far as "what to focus on," the bottom line is that there's no substitute for hard work. Want more funding and flexibility? Send more letters, work more fundraisers, and sell more lightbulbs. Choose to do a second event? Endlessly iterate your robot to get the most out of it. Focusing on offseason prototypes? Get the most out of limited resources by using them creatively, and putting in the hours on inventor to try to get it right the first time. No matter what you work on, working on it intensely will lead to success.

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by davidthefat

What I think the problem in our team is the lack of unity; we do not have a defined goal. Some kids are in it for the brownie points for college, some are in it for the fun, some want to just build robots, some are in it because they support FIRST's mission and others are in it for the competition. I need to unite the team under one goal.

Respectfully, why?

You have listed a number of motivations; don't confuse them with goals. Are any of those motivations invalid reasons for kids to get involved and hopefully get inspired? I don't think so.

Goals would be something like

• building a robot that will lead to us being ...
• getting involved in our community by ...
• showing students career pathways in ...
• ensuring team sustainability by ...
• encouraging personal growth by ...

All noble goals - but they must be agreed upon by the team, not imposed. People will only work toward common goals when they are part of the goal-setting process.

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

All noble goals - but they must be agreed upon by the team, not imposed. People will only work toward common goals when they are part of the goal-setting process.

Wisdom.

Too much I, I, I and me, me, me does not a team make.

Too much time spent on CD immersed in the I, I, I and me, me, me focus does not a team member make.

--
My favorite part of FRC is the opportunity to brainstorm and problem-solve with different groups of people in all the aspects of FRC.

Jane

[Ankit S.]

I also agree with going to two regionals.

With that second regional, you have a chance to see more robots, different robots, and different designs. Those different designs might be what fuel you to make a different drivetrain. If one team has an innovative drivetrain, but goes to a regional thats far from your home, than you may lose the chance of seeing that drivetrain.

Also, many teams do better in their second regional than their first. Going to a second regional may keep the motivation higher if you do very well in your second regional.

One thing you could do is have the students pay for travel expenses and food; that is what our team does for our "away" regional.

This way you wont need to spend 7000 on that second regional, only ~4000. Thats an extra 3000 dollars in the bag.

If you do manage to get at least 12-15k as your budget this year, you should be going to that second regional.

As for leaving behind a legacy of CAD and design and prototyping, start teaching the team how to CAD, and start fully designing before fabrication.

Good luck.

[thefro526]

My favorite part of FRC?

The people.

Those people make robots seem uninteresting.

[XaulZan11]

One issue that I don't believe has been brought up in the 2nd regional or offseason prototyping discussion is that it can be very hard to get students excited and involved in working on stuff during the summer that they may never use again. While nearly all students are excited and involved in a second regional, you may be lucky to get 1/3 of the students involved in offseason testing. I agree that on paper, offseason prototyping probably provides the return on investment in terms of learning and increasing the chance of future success, but it may be hard to get potentially short sighted students on board.

My suggestion would be to combine both of these and attend a couple of offseasons. You can still do the prototyping, but this time it has a more practical application--the actual competition. You can do anything from tweaking existing systems, completing re-doing subsystems, using a completely new drivetrain, to building a brand new robot (check out 1625 from this year and I believe 2949 from 2010). Plus, you can train new drivers, pit crew and scouts at these events.