Go to Post I believe the only cure... is more cowbell? :D - The Megan 2207 [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > ChiefDelphi.com Website > Extra Discussion
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 10:05
MikeBrock MikeBrock is offline
Registered User
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: PA!
Posts: 33
MikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond repute
pic: Robot Concept CAD

Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 10:07
sgreco's Avatar
sgreco sgreco is offline
Registered User
AKA: Steven Greco
FRC #2079
Team Role: Mechanical
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Millis
Posts: 1,031
sgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond reputesgreco has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

You're not going to want to waterjet that out of a single piece of Aluminum. That's going to be incredibly expensive.

That frame will be much easier made with aluminum square tubing.
Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 11:53
lemiant's Avatar
lemiant lemiant is offline
the Dreamer
AKA: Alex
FRC #4334 (Alberta Tech Alliance)
Team Role: Leadership
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 562
lemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond reputelemiant has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Very cool! However, as much as you think that's simple, it actually sounds pretty complex for a rookie bot. You might want to take a look some of the shooter prototypes people are posting on here and make sure you really want a catapult. Nice CAD btw

- Alex
Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 12:02
MikeBrock MikeBrock is offline
Registered User
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: PA!
Posts: 33
MikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgreco View Post
You're not going to want to waterjet that out of a single piece of Aluminum. That's going to be incredibly expensive.

That frame will be much easier made with aluminum square tubing.
This is very true. How about waterjetting 1/8" plates for the top and bottom to hold together 2x1 tubing?


I do no see why this would be more complicated than a shooter, Lemiant. Care to explain your thought process?

-MB
Reply With Quote
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 12:53
Siri's Avatar
Siri Siri is offline
Dare greatly
AKA: 1640 coach 2010-2014
FRC #2641 (PCCR; Refs & RIs)
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 1,632
Siri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond reputeSiri has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via ICQ to Siri
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBrock View Post
This is very true. How about waterjetting 1/8" plates for the top and bottom to hold together 2x1 tubing?
You could, but what are you gaining with that? (Besides weight) I think you may well find that welding/riveting/bolting the 2x1" together with corner gussets will save you significant money and waterjet time. You also might want to put some more thought into the drivetrain before committing to 1x1" instead. Certainly plenty of robots drive with great 1x1" frame members, but attaching your wheel axles directly through 1x1" profile doesn't leave a whole lot of metal around most axles.

In places where you decide you need aluminum in non-stock profiles (a taller frame or a wider baseplate, etc), you can definitely get really creative. Also remember that it doesn't have to by aluminum, though. Many a nice electrical panel was made of plywood, carbon fiber, and many things in between.

With reference to the shooter: First, please, please, do not cantilever that axle. But more systematically, "non-continuous" shooters (as opposed to easy-to-turn-on wheels, cam-arming shooters, etc) in which you have to execute separate actions to load, arm, fire, etc can often be more complicated, especially with such a huge moment arm. (They weren't uncommon in things like Breakaway, where the travel distance was usually minimal.) It leaves you things with a few more challenges than normal.
- Where and what is the cylinder? And how precisely do you plan to use it? Is it providing the actual launch power?
- Where is the roller/how do you store and pickup balls and get them in the cradle?
- How long will it take to reload, and what's the range? (adjustable?)
- Most importantly, what are your design requirements? Are you meeting them with this?

On a catapult specific level, how far are you planning to shoot? Without knowing the specifics (CG), I'd be a little surprised if your back wheels stayed on the ground when launching for considerable distance.

Also, are your mecanum wheels mounted correctly? In the iso view it looks like they don't form an "X" from the top. Not a big issue in CAD, but your robot won't like it much.

Still your CAD is quite solid and your idea (even if I disagree with it) has a nice conceptual start. I can't say I'd do it, but if you've got a valid strategy, strong design requirements, excellent testing data, and the wherewithal to overcome the non-continuous shooter challenges, don't let us push you down.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 15:45
poohbear poohbear is offline
Registered User
FRC #3815
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: dirty south
Posts: 7
poohbear is on a distinguished road
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

This is a great idea, comrad!!!
Reply With Quote
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 16:03
scottydoh scottydoh is offline
CAD, Mechanical, Alumni, Mentor
AKA: Scott
FRC #0810 (Mechanical Bulls)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Smithtown, Long Island, NY
Posts: 236
scottydoh is a name known to allscottydoh is a name known to allscottydoh is a name known to allscottydoh is a name known to allscottydoh is a name known to allscottydoh is a name known to all
Send a message via AIM to scottydoh Send a message via Yahoo to scottydoh
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBrock View Post
This is very true. How about waterjetting 1/8" plates for the top and bottom to hold together 2x1 tubing?
I see to need for a plate on both the top and the bottom. 1/8th or 3/16th plate on top of 1x1 tubing would be plenty. Or better yet, why not just use the provided kit bot frame? For the past 3 years my team has been using the kit bot frame with a water jet cut top plate for mounting and to keep things square (mind you, prior to 2008 they insisted upon custom building an entire frame, bottom plate + 6 walls out of 3/16 water jet cut plate...so much excess weight and time wasted on design). With the kit bot frame, we can usually have the chassis set up within the first week.

EDIT: Also, just another thought, I don't know how familiar you are with the Mecanum system, but each wheel needs to be powered individually, that means each wheel gets its own motor and gearbox. And from the looks of your drawing (which by the way is indeed very nice) Your wheels are outside the frame perimeter and thus illegal, unless of course your frame was smaller than 28x38.
__________________
www.smithtownrobotics.com
Robot Inspector (SBPLI 2011)
2011 Johnson & Johnson Gracious Professionalism (NYC) Judges Award (SBPLI)
2009 Xerox Creativity (SBPLI)
Mechanical Bulls; Student Leader 2006-2008, Mentor 2009-Present
New York Institute of Technology - Architecture '13 | Design Portfolio:www.coroflot.com/sdifiore

Last edited by scottydoh : 13-01-2012 at 16:06.
Reply With Quote
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 17:09
Sean Raia's Avatar
Sean Raia Sean Raia is offline
Curious spectator & alumn
no team
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 433
Sean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond reputeSean Raia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by poohbear View Post
This is a great idea, comrad!!!
There is no way that poohbear just stumbled upon this. I smell a troll thread!
Reply With Quote
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 18:01
MikeBrock MikeBrock is offline
Registered User
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: PA!
Posts: 33
MikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Ah yes, I am aware of the wheel orientation. I was quickly making a CAD and just used the mirror component tool. And yes, I am well aware of the individual power to each wheel.

As for the cantilevered shaft on the arm, I totally missed that, my apologies. It should be constrained in the center.

As for recoil, we are not worried about that, we plan on taking very close shots with this design so one pneumatic piston will be enough for power. We may add some sort of spring and release mechanism. The roller on the cradle of the arm is not in the CAD, but you might be able to see the mounting holes for it. Once I fix the CAD you will be able to see how the arm can swing down with ease to suck a ball in.

The frame is now going to be welded. Thanks for that suggestion.

-MB
Reply With Quote
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 18:24
EricH's Avatar
EricH EricH is offline
New year, new team
FRC #1197 (Torbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 19,803
EricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Raia View Post
There is no way that poohbear just stumbled upon this. I smell a troll thread!
Nah, this one might actually be viable. Unlike a certain 4-traction-wheel arrangement...

This one just needs some tweaking. I believe I saw a team's video of a catapult design for Lunacy. (They didn't go with it that year.)
__________________
Past teams:
2003-2007: FRC0330 BeachBots
2008: FRC1135 Shmoebotics
2012: FRC4046 Schroedinger's Dragons

"Rockets are tricky..."--Elon Musk

Reply With Quote
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 18:24
Crawler Crawler is offline
Registered User
FRC #3749
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 19
Crawler is a jewel in the roughCrawler is a jewel in the roughCrawler is a jewel in the roughCrawler is a jewel in the rough
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

personally i would go with the base design they gave you, and not go with mechenium wheels unless you have a very awesome team of mentors that have done FRC for a while. Aside from that good cad, and i would love to see a catapult somewhere, i think most are going with a base ball type shooter
Reply With Quote
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 20:40
goldenglove002 goldenglove002 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Alex Epstein
FRC #1311 (Kell Robotics)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Blacksburg, VA
Posts: 54
goldenglove002 is a jewel in the roughgoldenglove002 is a jewel in the roughgoldenglove002 is a jewel in the rough
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

If you're trying to keep it simple, why not just use the kitbot frame that comes in the kit of parts? You won't have to pay for anything extra, it comes together very quickly, and it's been proven to work. There's a reason FIRST gives it to us.
__________________


2011 Peachtree Regional Dean's List Recipient
2011 Peachtree Regional Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers Entrepreneurship Award
2011 Lemelson/MIT InvenTeams Grant
2010 North Carolina Regional Chairmans Award
2010 Peachtree Regional Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers Entrepreneurship Award
2010 SeaWorld Busch Gardens Environmental Excellence Award
2009 Peachtree Regional Chairmans Award
2008 Peachtree Regional Judges Award
Reply With Quote
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 21:08
mdiradoorian mdiradoorian is offline
FIRST Alum
AKA: Matthew
FRC #0696 (CircuitBreakers)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Rookie Year: 2010
Location: Glendale, Ca
Posts: 254
mdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant futuremdiradoorian has a brilliant future
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

I am hoping that your goal is NOT supposed to go over the barrier because your mechanum wheels may break and will spend a lot of time to be fixing it at the competition. Other than that the inventor model is good.
__________________
Team 696 2010-2013 Student

2014 2x Industrial Design Award Winners CVR and LAR
2013 Inland Empire Finalists -696 Circuitbreakers, 3476 Code Orange, and 4140 Wired
Reply With Quote
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 13-01-2012, 23:12
MikeBrock MikeBrock is offline
Registered User
no team
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: PA!
Posts: 33
MikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond reputeMikeBrock has a reputation beyond repute
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdiradoorian View Post
I am hoping that your goal is NOT supposed to go over the barrier because your mechanum wheels may break and will spend a lot of time to be fixing it at the competition. Other than that the inventor model is good.
We plan to go over the bridge, not the bump. Implying that we might plan to go over the bump is a bit insulting to our intelligence. However, what if we added some sort of high strength shims along the front and back of the wheels (like fenders) out of something like steel or titanium. I think it would work in theory.

Why would mentor experience have anything to do with using mecanum wheels? There are boatloads of teams who have published mecanum drive code.

I was thinking; everyone complains about being pushed around with mecanum wheels. What if we used the internals of a shifting gearbox (they seem pretty simple) to make each wheel have two speeds? Then, a curved plate with some high friction material (traction tread) could come down on the rollers of each wheel and act as a brake. It would solve those issues but still allow us to strafe and slide around.

As for using the kit base: we don't see the need.

Last edited by MikeBrock : 13-01-2012 at 23:30.
Reply With Quote
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2012, 00:31
CNettles11's Avatar
CNettles11 CNettles11 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Chris Nettles
FRC #3502 (Octo-Pi-Rates)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 122
CNettles11 is a jewel in the roughCNettles11 is a jewel in the roughCNettles11 is a jewel in the roughCNettles11 is a jewel in the rough
Re: pic: Robot Concept CAD

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBrock View Post
As for using the kit base: we don't see the need.
The kit base is simple, easily assembled, and saves time and money that could be put towards other things, like a reliable ball pickup, bridge tipper and the most important thing, driver practice!
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 16:14.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi