Bumper question

[Cyberphil]

I did mean Maximum.

This is what I (and many teamates) believe also. I am going to post this to the Q and A anyway, but thank you for your input! It is always greatly appreciated!

[Al Skierkiewicz]

Team Update #2 that came out on Friday adds something to this discussion.

[JChavis]

Since it seems that we are already talking about a square U shape for our bumpers, how should teams go around and place their team numbers on the side with the split bumper?

Should teams place the numbers like this:

1. [0000]_______[____]
2. [000_]_______[____]
3. [00__]_______[____]


Or like this:

4. [__00]_______[00__]
5. [__00]_______[0___]
6. [___0]_______[0___]


Our number is 3490, and I am thinking we should split the numbers across the face of the split side (#4).

[Cyberphil]

Also, there are two answers on the QnA that partially answer my question, but they still will probably not be enough.

Q. In regards to Bumper Rule R27, when it states that "8" of bumper must be placed on each side of the exterior vertex...to provide adequate protection", does this mean that the bumpers themselves must be 8" long and 5" of the robot be covered or the bumpers be 11" and cover 8" of robot?

A. The 8 in. of Frame Perimeter immediately on either side of an exterior vertex must be covered by a Bumper.

The key word in there is immediately, meaning right up against each exterior vertex on both sides. I am convinced, but others still are not.

Also, just recently there was my exact question posted on the QnA:

Does the 8" of bumper on the "side of each vertex" mean that there have to be 8" of bumper from each corner (16" total), or 8" of bumper on that side total (8" total, 4" from each corner)?

Looking forward to when that one is answered.

[engunneer]

JChavis, I'd say option 1, especially if the gap in your bumpers is very wide. There's nothing that says you have to have only one number per side


Cyberphil,
From R27

For adequate protection, at least 8 in. of Bumper must be placed on each side of each exterior vertex

8" on each side of each vertex means 8" on the turnwise side, and 8" on the widdershins side. (CW and CCW). The corners need to be protected, but don't count as part of the 8". 8" of frame need to be protected on each side.

[JChavis]

Originally Posted by engunneer

JChavis, I'd say option 1, especially if the gap in your bumpers is very wide. There's nothing that says you have to have only one number per side

Well, I guess you're right. I just asked the question just in case field refs can't see a blocked half on a pinned robot. But then again, there are the other remaining 2 sides to show the number....


Thanks!

[Al Skierkiewicz]

J,
While team numbers may be obvious to you and may meet the rule and pass inspection, there is one thing to consider. (I use this argument during inspection) You want to play on Saturday afternoon and that often requires other teams know who you are. If you make it easy for them, you increase your chances. Marketing is a big key.

[JChavis]

Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz

J,
While team numbers may be obvious to you and may meet the rule and pass inspection, there is one thing to consider. (I use this argument during inspection) You want to play on Saturday afternoon and that often requires other teams know who you are. If you make it easy for them, you increase your chances. Marketing is a big key.

Well in that case, would it be okay to place your entire number on BOTH sides of the split face?

[Cyberphil]

Originally Posted by engunneer

8" on each side of each vertex means 8" on the turnwise side, and 8" on the widdershins side. (CW and CCW). The corners need to be protected, but don't count as part of the 8". 8" of frame need to be protected on each side.

Ok, I agree with you on that. The rule is questionable at this point. Your reading of the rules also implies you could split the bumpers up into eight 1" lengths of bumper, put them on one side of your robot equally spaced (with two of them filling the corners on each side) and that would be legal. But read the ruling from the QnA (my previous post) about a different question regarding bumpers. The answer on the QnA states:

A. The 8 in. of Frame Perimeter immediately on either side of an exterior vertex must be covered by a Bumper.

My interpretation of that answer is take any exterior vertex, take a tape measure from that exterior vertex 8" along one side the frame. That area is where bumpers must be. Preforming that process on each side of exterior vertex (8 different places) would give you a minimum of 16" of bumper on each side.

For the time being the rule is still up in the air to many people. Just wait until the newest R27 question is answered. It will answer this discrepancy.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by JChavis

Well in that case, would it be okay to place your entire number on BOTH sides of the split face?

I think you should ask Q&A that one; I think you'd be OK, but the rule could reasonably be read that more than 4 locations isn't allowed.

But, there are zero restrictions on where else on the robot you have your number. Just make sure that there's a contrasting background behind the number so scouts can read it from the top of the stands. (Hint: Black on clear isn't going to show up very well. Put some paper behind it, though, and it'll stand out.)

[GaryVoshol]

Originally Posted by JChavis

Since it seems that we are already talking about a square U shape for our bumpers, how should teams go around and place their team numbers on the side with the split bumper?

Should teams place the numbers like this:

1. [0000]_______[____]
2. [000_]_______[____]
3. [00__]_______[____]


Or like this:

4. [__00]_______[00__]
5. [__00]_______[0___]
6. [___0]_______[0___]


Our number is 3490, and I am thinking we should split the numbers across the face of the split side (#4).

As a ref, I would prefer method 1/2/3. I want to be able to see the whole number at one time. With method 4, I might get confused between 3490 and teams 34 or 90. Methods 5 and 6 seem particulary obnoxious to me - I think it's the single digit by itself that looks bad (unless you are one of those single digit teams!).

I wouldn't have a problem at all with [3490]_______[3490], provided you don't use one of those numbers as a substitute for the number being on another face of the robot. But as Eric mentioned, you should probably clear it through Q&A.

[Cyberphil]

So, as for the question about R27 (8" on each side of each vertex) this is what the QnA answered:

Q. Does the 8" of bumper on the "side of each vertex" mean that there have to be 8" of bumper from each corner (16" total), or 8" of bumper on that side total (8" total, 4" from each corner)?
A. Please refer to [R27]. At least 8 in. of Bumper must be installed on each side of the vertex.

Does this help our discussion whatsoever? They did not clarify anything we found there to be multiple interpretations of.

[Brighid.b]

To everyone, if you are using a multidimensional frame do bumpers need to cover both the bottom and upper deck?? Or is it ok to have the bumpers a tad bit lower then the upper deck but still within bumper zone? And attached to lower deck?

[Al Skierkiewicz]

Brig,
The bumpers must be attached to the frame perimeter and be between 2" and 10" above the floor when the robot is flat on the floor. The frame perimeter is the outermost extent of the frame in the bumper zone. Nothing can extend beyond the Frame Perimeter except the single appendage that may deployed during the match. If the upper deck and lower deck are different dimensions but both exist within the bumper zone, only one can define the frame perimeter. As stated, the perimeter is established by wrapping a string around the exterior vertices of the robot. Remember that in this critical discussion, a team must satisfy all bumper rules. Whatever part of the robot is the larger, the bumpers must be attached to it and it must fit in the size constraints. To add one more item, while bolt heads, welds and other protuberances may cause gaps behind the bumper, the robot must fit into the sizing box with the protuberances. At no time can small items be larger than the specified dimensions given in the robot rules.

[Brighid.b]

So in summation a set of bumpers are legal as long as they are protecting the vertices and the outter most perimeter? if if part of the frame is taller than the place where bumpers would be going?