2012 Match Initial Observations

[Ian Curtis]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

Not much in the way of defense but I doubt teams like 23 and 125 are gonna be allowed to make a living parking in front of the basket and popping balls in at their leisure all day long especially in St. Louis.

I disagree. We won a regional ramp camping in 2006, and in ATL still did well enough to seed in the top 8. We mostly shot from the ramp, but we would shoot from the base if we had to. The only times we were ever effectively defended was when a big name team with good scouting was the other alliance. Unless we see some really fantastic launchers I would wager that the 2168s and 125s of the world do pretty well. I really have a hard time seeing wheeled launchers getting the consistency from the key, but we haven't seen what the tippy top tier is up to yet.

I really like this game. The audience seems to get into it in a way we haven't seen since 2008, every time the net swooshed the crowd stood or their arms went up. The end game is exciting, watching those teeter totters rock back and forth was nerve racking! I think the point balance is about right too, while a balance is worth a lot of points, if the match is close you can still see the down team matching the balance or maybe even scoring a couple more points to still win. I think balancing is about the right level of difficulty too -- it isn't easy but we saw it quite a few times on the webcast, which is promising. The first 3 balance is going to knock the crowd of their feet.

Strategically, knocking the balls on the ramp to your side of the field is huge. So is autonomous.

I think we're in for a good year. (Except for the enormous monkey wrench in the works that is the Coopertition Bridge. There is a lot of potential for bad blood on that field element.)

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Ian Curtis

I disagree. We won a regional ramp camping in 2006, and in ATL still did well enough to seed in the top 8. We mostly shot from the ramp, but we would shoot from the base if we had to. The only times we were ever effectively defended was when a big name team with good scouting was the other alliance. Unless we see some really fantastic launchers I would wager that the 2168s and 125s of the world do pretty well. I really have a hard time seeing wheeled launchers getting the consistency from the key, but we haven't seen what the tippy top tier is up to yet.

I really like this game. The audience seems to get into it in a way we haven't seen since 2008, every time the net swooshed the crowd stood or their arms went up. The end game is exciting, watching those teeter totters rock back and forth was nerve racking! I think the point balance is about right too, while a balance is worth a lot of points, if the match is close you can still see the down team matching the balance or maybe even scoring a couple more points to still win. I think balancing is about the right level of difficulty too -- it isn't easy but we saw it quite a few times on the webcast, which is promising. The first 3 balance is going to knock the crowd of their feet.

Strategically, knocking the balls on the ramp to your side of the field is huge. So is autonomous.

I think we're in for a good year. (Except for the enormous monkey wrench in the works that is the Coopertition Bridge. There is a lot of potential for bad blood on that field element.)

Just because something worked in the past does not mean it will work today. Aim High and this game are different.

[ThirteenOfTwo]

I'm mostly interested in whether anyone was crossing the field--our drive train doesn't cross the bump (but is very fast on the bridge), so it'd be great to know in advance if that's going to be a crippling decision so that we can possibly whip something up using the withholding allowance.

Originally Posted by kborer22

6. Defense seemed useless. we parked in front of the fender and teams were able to back up to the key. Also, the high risk of penalties hardly seems worth getting anywhere near a robot shooting from the key. Well see how it plays out

Did anyone try to play a more agile defense? In the matches I saw, all of the defensive robots just tried to ram their opponents into submission... to my thinking, the best way of playing defense in this game is being quick enough to snag the rebounds on all of the missed shots.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by ThirteenOfTwo

Did anyone try to play a more agile defense? In the matches I saw, all of the defensive robots just tried to ram their opponents into submission.. ..

The classic form of FIRST defense. Depending on rules can be very effective (2007, 2009, 2010) or potentially very damaging to your chances of winning (2005, 2011 and this year). Mostly due to a "no-contact" zone on the field that is often forgotten or ignored by aggressive drivers.

[Andy Grady]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

The classic form of FIRST defense. Depending on rules can be very effective (2007, 2009, 2010) or potentially very damaging to your chances of winning (2005, 2011 and this year). Mostly due to a "no-contact" zone on the field that is often forgotten or ignored by aggressive drivers.

Also factor in that the "no contact zone" only gets bigger as more robots stuff themselves in at the border of the key. I think the lack of defense at Suffield was based mainly off of two things...

1. The fear of getting fouls just traveling to the fender.
2. Teams inability to even cross over from one side of the field to the next.

I wouldn't expect 2 to be an issue as we get deeper into the season, but 1 will remain a massive factor.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Andy Grady

I wouldn't expect 2 to be an issue as we get deeper into the season, but 1 will remain a massive factor.

The fresh painful memories of such consequences are still fresh in many teams mind from last year.

[Brandon Holley]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

The fresh painful memories of such consequences are still fresh in many teams mind from last year.

As they are for us...

I feel for any alliance, sending a defensive between the key and the fender is going to be taking a huge risk. There will be teams who do it extremely well, as there always is. However, the drivers of that defensive robot will need to be on their toes and very aware of where they are. We will see many teams parking just on the edge of the key. Defensive teams will have a 3+ foot radius around the key to be aware of at all times. The best defense will be teams who can clear the other alliance's zone of rebounds/stray balls.

-Brando

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by Andy Grady

Also factor in that the "no contact zone" only gets bigger as more robots stuff themselves in at the border of the key. I think the lack of defense at Suffield was based mainly off of two things...

1. The fear of getting fouls just traveling to the fender.
2. Teams inability to even cross over from one side of the field to the next.

I wouldn't expect 2 to be an issue as we get deeper into the season, but 1 will remain a massive factor.

A third reason you didn't see defense at Suffield Shakedown: no team came to play defense to win the game. They came to refine their offensive capabilities on an official field. Defense will come because a good 60-70% of teams at regionals won't make one shot in the hoop. These teams may not play an ideal defense, but it will be an annoying one.

[Squeakypig]

Defenders will actually be at a driving advantage compared to the offensive robots in that zone since the drivers of defensive robots will be right there on that side of the field. A well practiced drive team will be able to defend and clear balls to the other side of the field with minimal chances for penalties I think. This might actually be a year where you see a 'powerhouse team' play defense and be successful at it!