Go to Post FIRST is an opportunity for me to tackle problems that have long been solved. - Madison [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > FIRST > General Forum
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 01:22
EricH's Avatar
EricH EricH is offline
New year, new team
FRC #1197 (Torbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 19,731
EricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond repute
What is GP to YOU?

Before I begin, I will note that this question has been asked and answered in the past, though not quite in this form. Some of the spotlights show this.

What is GP?

The simple definition, of course, is to expand that acronym into the full phrase, Gracious Professionalism. But the real definition may be far deeper.

In the multiple years that I have been a member of these forums, I have seen just about anything someone doesn't like called "un-GP". This could be anything from building a practice robot to various (legal) game strategies to having "mentor-built" robots. In almost every case, the person making that particular claim is promptly told that he/she is wrong in making the claim. Why is that person wrong, either in the claim's content or in the fact that it's made at all? Also, why is the callout of somebody being GP rarely heard?

Before I post my thoughts, I would like to hear some of yours. Here are some guidelines to help you form your thoughts:

1) What is Gracious Professionalism to you personally?
1a) Conversely, what is "un-GP" to you personally?
2) Keep it clean--no accusations (specific or general), please. Situational examples, particularly hypothetical ones, are encouraged, however.
3) For purposes of this thread, I want personal opinions, not necessarily team opinions. In other words, I'd really like it if entire teams aren't judged by someone's post in this thread, as happens on occasion when the accusations start flying.


Why am I posting this thread?
--I think that the meaning of Gracious Professionalism may have been lost in translation between generations of FIRSTers. Or it's been changed subtly over the years so that the old-timers don't recognize it.
--It's quite possible that rookies haven't learned about it fully yet. This is a good opportunity to teach them--they're done building, but not yet in the heat of competition.
--Ditto for some of the veterans--it's a good refresher, even if you learned the concept thoroughly and live it.
--It's a mental exercise. Can't have a bunch of engineering-type minds idling for two weeks now, can we?

Again, I'll post my thoughts later; they're still mildly scrambled right now. Written things make so much more sense when you're awake enough to tidy them up to be legible.
__________________
Past teams:
2003-2007: FRC0330 BeachBots
2008: FRC1135 Shmoebotics
2012: FRC4046 Schroedinger's Dragons

"Rockets are tricky..."--Elon Musk

Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 01:26
zachmartin1806's Avatar
zachmartin1806 zachmartin1806 is offline
Registered User
FRC #1806 (S.W.A.T. Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Smithville, MO
Posts: 92
zachmartin1806 has a spectacular aura aboutzachmartin1806 has a spectacular aura aboutzachmartin1806 has a spectacular aura about
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP: When you get to a competition and help a team put together their entire robot knowing you'll be competing against them that the same day
__________________

2013 - Greater Kansas City: Regional Winners (1986, 2457), Judges Award; Oklahoma City: Regional Winners (1986, 2389)
2012 - Oklahoma City: Innovation in Control Award
2011-10,000 Lakes: Dean's List Finalist , Coopratition Award
2010 - St. Louis: Regional Finalists (1098, 1329)
2009 - Greater Kansas City: Regional Winners (1208, 931), General Motors Industrial Design Award; St. Louis Regional: General Motors Industrial Design Award
2008 - Greater Kansas City: Regional Winners (476, 1802), Johnson & Johnson Gracious Professionalism Award; Oklahoma: Regional Winners (2165, 2354), Motorola Quality Award
Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 01:55
Grim Tuesday's Avatar
Grim Tuesday Grim Tuesday is offline
Registered User
AKA: Simon Bohn
FRC #0639 (Code Red)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2010
Location: Baltimore MD (JHU)
Posts: 1,604
Grim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond reputeGrim Tuesday has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP is helping other teams so that you will both have the best experience.

EDIT: Let me expand this. GP is doing anything to ensure that other people are happy too. What's not GP? Being rude is a simple example. You're making someone else not have a good time. I'll post more later, but this is what first came to mind.
Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 02:09
nitneylion452's Avatar
nitneylion452 nitneylion452 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Joe Lee
FRC #3167 (Environmental Tectonics Crusaders)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2010
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 596
nitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud ofnitneylion452 has much to be proud of
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP can have very different meanings in different situations, but I feel a good general definition is as follows:

Going above and beyond the call of duty to help a teammate, friend, fellow team, or community. I think the idea Gracious Professionalism is all too often considered something that only exists in FIRST. In reality, it applies to life, too,

A good metaphor for GP, in my mind, is the Medal of Honor.
__________________
Joe
"The ones who will one day rule the world rule the basketball court today."

http://www.fatherjudgerobotics.webs.com

Volunteer 2012 MAR Region Championship - Field Reset
Volunteer 2013 MAR Region Championship - Field Reset
Reply With Quote
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 04:30
Koko Ed's Avatar
Koko Ed Koko Ed is offline
Serial Volunteer
AKA: Ed Patterson
FRC #0191 (X-Cats)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Rookie Year: 2002
Location: Rochester,NY
Posts: 22,926
Koko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond reputeKoko Ed has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

Putting aside whatever differences you have to reach a common goal.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 07:38
Tetraman's Avatar
Tetraman Tetraman is offline
FIRST on my mind
AKA: Evan Raitt
no team
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Rookie Year: 2002
Location: Manchester, NH
Posts: 1,322
Tetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond reputeTetraman has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

When a student, mentor or team is unselfish toward those he she or them competes against and cares more for the well-being, learning and potential of another student, mentor or team than any fame or blue banner could ever promote; is when GP exists.

There is no such thing as "un-GP." When something is the opposite of GP, it simply is what it is. GP is not a standard; not to be forced onto someone or some team as a 'shame on you' for doing the opposite of our most exploited two-word phrase. Only when we see true Gracious Professionalism is when should we mention it at all.

This, obviously, is what it means to me and how I speak it to others.
__________________
"For every great theory about design, there is a better and contradictory theory about design. And don't let the irony of that escape you."
Reply With Quote
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 07:44
Taylor's Avatar
Taylor Taylor is offline
Professor of Thinkology, ThD
AKA: @taylorstem
FRC #3487 (EarthQuakers)
Team Role: Teacher
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA 46227
Posts: 4,581
Taylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

Gracious Professionalism is declining an alliance invitation without creating hurt feelings or animosity.

Gracious Professionalism is being declined when offering an alliance invitation while realizing that team is doing what it believes is in its best interest.

Gracious Professionalism is watching a team decline another's request at alliance pairing without booing or catcalling.

Gracious Professionalism is being embarrassed at an event by an underperforming catstrophe of a robot, yet standing and applauding for every award because you realize that as hard as you worked that season, the other team must have worked even harder to get their achievements.
__________________
Hi!
Reply With Quote
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 08:00
JamesCH95's Avatar
JamesCH95 JamesCH95 is offline
Hardcore Dork
AKA: JCH
FRC #0095 (The Grasshoppers)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Enfield, NH
Posts: 1,812
JamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP is knowing that we are all on the same team, not matter what number is on our robot.

This means helping, supporting, encouraging, and constructively criticizing each other as we would our own team.
__________________
Theory is a nice place, I'd like to go there one day, I hear everything works there.

Maturity is knowing you were an idiot, common sense is trying to not be an idiot, wisdom is knowing that you will still be an idiot.
Reply With Quote
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 08:18
Richard Wallace's Avatar
Richard Wallace Richard Wallace is offline
I live for the details.
FRC #3620 (Average Joes)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Southwestern Michigan
Posts: 3,630
Richard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond reputeRichard Wallace has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?


This scene from Buckeye 2005 is one of my most cherished memories of GP in action.
__________________
Richard Wallace

Mentor since 2011 for FRC 3620 Average Joes (St. Joseph, Michigan)
Mentor 2002-10 for FRC 931 Perpetual Chaos (St. Louis, Missouri)
since 2003

I believe in intuition and inspiration. Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited, whereas imagination embraces the entire world, stimulating progress, giving birth to evolution. It is, strictly speaking, a real factor in scientific research.
(Cosmic Religion : With Other Opinions and Aphorisms (1931) by Albert Einstein, p. 97)
Reply With Quote
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 10:24
JaneYoung JaneYoung is offline
Onward through the fog.
no team
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Rookie Year: 2002
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 5,996
JaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond reputeJaneYoung has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

I stayed awake most of the night thinking about this thread, Eric.

What I decided right before I went to sleep was that I didn't want to stray too far from Dr. Flowers thoughts and words. I've looked up his definition on the FIRST website and I also read the definition of Coopertition.

What I'm thinking about right now is that Gracious Professionalism and Coopertition work together but they are not necessarily the same thing. Gracious Professionalism can lift out of the competition field and into the community, creating unlimited possibilities for global impact and awareness in how we work together and communicate with each other.

Here's the link to the 2 definitions in the FIRST website.

I spent the night thinking about all of my wonderful experiences in FIRST that have witnessed what Gracious Professionalism is and what it is capable of. I have also witnessed many moments that have involved Coopertition. It's been a great 10 years and I'm a better person for it.

Jane
__________________
Excellence is contagious. ~ Andy Baker, President, AndyMark, Inc. and Woodie Flowers Award 2003

Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, ambition inspired, and success achieved.
~ Helen Keller
(1880-1968)

Last edited by Madison : 26-02-2012 at 13:47. Reason: correcting typo by request
Reply With Quote
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 19:28
EricH's Avatar
EricH EricH is offline
New year, new team
FRC #1197 (Torbots)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 19,731
EricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond reputeEricH has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

Here are some of my thoughts. There might be more later.

It is possible to separate the two halves of Gracious Professionalism. However, if you do it, you can get some interesting situations. For example, too much Gracious can result in running matches 7 hours after the event is supposed to be over because two teams can't connect to the field fast enough every single round. Overemphasis on Professionalism means those teams get zero matches due to connecting 120 seconds+ late in any given match (and thereby not being allowed to compete), but the event runs on time.

By linking the two into one phrase, the meaning is charged towards balancing the two. In the above example, it's giving the team a little extra time to try to connect, and assigning someone to find their issue whenever they aren't on the field. Trying to get them onto the field every match, with a fast enough connection time that they don't get left out.

GP is not something that should be used as an accusatory tool. Too many people have tried to do this in the past few years. Rich Kressly said it best: "Only think of Gracious Professionalism as a standard to work toward personally. Never use it as a gauge to point out someone else’s shortcomings."

While using GP to point out shortcomings may be professional (which is debatable), it certainly isn't gracious. This is where the opposite of GP, also known as asinine incompetence, comes in. Also separable, "ai" implies that not only do you not have a clue what you're doing, but you also are rude and/or crude while you're doing it. Nobody wants to have that tag applied to them; this is why I do my best not to apply it.

Cries of "GP! GP!" aren't heard as often because Gracious Professionalism is common--maybe too common. Teams and individuals have to do something extraordinary to have it be talked about. On the other hand, the cry of "un-GP" arises when someone thinks--not necessarily knows--that someone else is not being "GP", whatever "GP" means to whoever happens to be complaining. When there's a lot of unrecognized GP going around, the rare "un-GP" call gets a lot of sudden attention.
__________________
Past teams:
2003-2007: FRC0330 BeachBots
2008: FRC1135 Shmoebotics
2012: FRC4046 Schroedinger's Dragons

"Rockets are tricky..."--Elon Musk

Reply With Quote
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 21:18
BJC's Avatar
BJC BJC is offline
Simplicity is Complicated!
AKA: Bryan Culver
FRC #0033 (The Killer Bees)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Kettering/Greenville
Posts: 704
BJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond reputeBJC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

I find that the idea "GP" is trying to convay is actually pretty simple.

1. Compete like crazy on the field, and cooperate like crazy off of it.
2. Don't be an idiot.

Really, it's just that easy. I also recall some spotlight post from a while back that went something to the tune of, "I can't exactly define Gracious Professionalism, but I sure know when I'm not living up to it."

When push comes to shove, I don't think that GP is something that is really meant to be defined, but rather something that is ment to be lived out and acted upon.

Regards, Bryan
__________________
robot robot robot? Robot. Robot? Robot!
-----------------Team 33------------------
Reply With Quote
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-02-2012, 21:28
GaryVoshol's Avatar
GaryVoshol GaryVoshol is offline
Cogito ergo arbitro
no team
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Rookie Year: 2000
Location: Royal Oak, MI
Posts: 5,726
GaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond reputeGaryVoshol has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP is not calling someone else non-GP.
__________________
(since 2004)
Reply With Quote
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 26-02-2012, 12:31
johnmaguire2013's Avatar
johnmaguire2013 johnmaguire2013 is offline
Harps On Websites
AKA: John Maguire
FRC #3322 (Eagle Imperium)
Team Role: Webmaster
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 74
johnmaguire2013 is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: What is GP to YOU?

GP is working to make sure other teams are having fun too.
Reply With Quote
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 26-02-2012, 14:44
RKElectricalman's Avatar
RKElectricalman RKElectricalman is offline
Meezy the Mentor
AKA: Rameez
FRC #0384 (Sparky 384)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Richmond, Va
Posts: 88
RKElectricalman is just really niceRKElectricalman is just really niceRKElectricalman is just really niceRKElectricalman is just really nice
Send a message via AIM to RKElectricalman
Re: What is GP to YOU?

To me, GP is working towards the benefit of a collective community, knowing you may be helping your future oponent. It could be helping them fix/build their robot on any day of the competition, entering into a mutually beneficial relationship, entering into a purely altruistic relationship, writing a white paper, sharing your code, or even sharing your ideas.

I agree that GP is something that you should strive towards, but not neccesarily a requirement. If the spirit of GP and the seed of inspiration can be instilled into the majority of FIRSTers our future will surely be brighter.

Cooperitition was based off of that premise that oponents can work together to achieve a common goal, which to me is the definition of GP.

Plain and simple: Un-GP isn't a real thing, unless it means "not in the spirit of GP" which as I've mentioned, shouldn't be pushed on everyone.

my 2 cents
__________________
ahhh Division Finalists!!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 16:03.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi