Can we use a gopro helmet camera?

[Marc S.]

The use of a camera with a separate powersupply from the main robot is leagal as long as it does not transmit or recieve data during a match.

[Brandon Holley]

Ours will be donning 2 GoPros all season.

-Brando

[jyh947]

The YouTube video you linked to is the MSC competition, where every robot in the Semi-Finals and Finals had to have a camera mounted on the robot because a television channel (I can't remember which one) was making a documentary about MSC.

[billbo911]

Originally Posted by Brandon Holley

Ours will be donning 2 GoPros all season.

-Brando

Ditto here Brandon. One HD Hero 2 and a standard Hero. The fun part is trying to figure out which to put where.

[Dusk Star]

Originally Posted by billbo911

Ditto here Brandon. One HD Hero 2 and a standard Hero. The fun part is trying to figure out which to put where.

One on the rotating turret, (the HD one) and another facing forwards?

[andreboos]

Originally Posted by Marc S.

The use of a camera with a separate powersupply from the main robot is leagal as long as it does not transmit or recieve data during a match.

Can a camera (video or otherwise) be considered a COTS computing device?

[Marc S.]

Originally Posted by andreboos

Can a camera (video or otherwise) be considered a COTS computing device?

That's a good question(off to read manual...). The cool thing with the camera is that unless you modify it, it's concidered a cots item and won't add to your 30lbs.

[cgmv123]

Yes, but it's not exempt from weight or cost restrictions.

My dad had a goPro attached at various points during our test run. Witness the results: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=276200042453874

[brysonhicks]

Thanks for you help! It appears that the camera should not cause any problems then and it does not cost over $400 so cost should not be an issue. I plan on using it during the competition.

[andreboos]

Its separate power supply would disqualify it per R36, regardless of cost or weight, unless it is classified as a COTS computing device (arguable).

[brysonhicks]

Have any people done it before? If so, then it seems like it would be allowed. Also, what is a cots computing device?

[andreboos]

A COTS computing device would be something like a laptop or PDA mounted on the robot. COTS (Commercial Off-The-Shelf) means that it is not modified from its original state (apart from software). The intent of R36 is to prevent non-approved power sources from being used, while permitting the use of portable computing devices that operate on their own battery. An example use might be to perform advanced image processing without slowing the cRIO. However, per R52, the device cannot control the robot in any way besides perhaps relaying information to the cRIO to use for its control decisions.

[jvriezen]

We had two GoPro cameras on our robot at Lake Superior, and our robot was inspected by "Big" Al, the head robot inspector for all of FIRST.

I think he was unaware of the Q&A cited earlier, because he said the camera need not be included in the BOM (we had done so). He also said it was not a COTS computing device. He classified it as a 'decoration' It does need to be included in weight, and it does need to be inspected for safety purposes and any other applicable rules.

[Doc Wu]

I saw several used this past weekend. None on any robots that I reviewed, so I didn't have to make any decisions.

I'm familiar with the GoPro cameras, having lusted after one for use in my cycling hobby. I haven't broken down and bought one yet, but for use in the application on the robot, I don't think you could ask for better. There are several other, similar, helmet-cam setups that would be equally at home on a bot, so this isn't an endorsement of a particular brand.

Pluses are they are nearly indestructable (made for sports use) self-contained power, small, light, and getting pretty cheap. So they are coming close to meeting all concerns about use on the robot. The GoPro mounting hardware is also good. No worry about wire-tieing it on when you have a choice of several types of brackets.

I think in the future, these might be more specifically addressed in the rules. The benefits of making POV video during matches can only help promote FIRST and the excitement of the competitions. Teams can use the video in creative ways to promote their team and FIRST as well as to diagnose the robot and strategy.

As long as they remain self-contained and the team has the room in their weight and cost budgets, it seems like they are enhancing the competition more than doing any harm.

[billbo911]

Originally Posted by Doc Wu

I think in the future, these might be more specifically addressed in the rules. The benefits of making POV video during matches can only help promote FIRST and the excitement of the competitions. Teams can use the video in creative ways to promote their team and FIRST as well as to diagnose the robot and strategy.

There is an additional bonus that we had not anticipated. While watching the video's after the matches, you can see exactly what the system was doing, sometimes the drive team didn't even realize they were doing it. Also, sometimes the audio reveals a problem you might not have noticed until a hard failure took place.

As examples: We noticed the co-pilot was cycling the shooter wheel when there was no need, he also had the ball collector running when there were no balls anywhere near. These two behaviors have an impact on driving by draining the battery needlessly.
We also noticed a quick drop out of the shooter wheel drive about 1 second before a shot in Autonomous. It came back up immediately and we made the shot, but without the video, we might not have diagnosed a logic issue in our code.