Boxing in

[Mongoose]

Is it legal for human players to put the boxes in a way so that the opponent robot(s) are walled off by boxes, or "boxed in"? It would make an interesting strategy, because if you put a box with its top right in front of an optical sensor or put enough boxes to divert a dead reckoning robot, that would wreak havoc in autonomous mode.

[AJ Quick]

"They will have 10 seconds to place or stack their containers anywhere in their own Scoring Zone and exit the field."

Anywhere in the red or blue area... so.. yes.

[Joe Ross]

I don't think that boxes will stop a dead reckoning robot, at least one with a decent drive train. It could very well stop a robot that is looking for the reflective tape , depending on the height at which it looks for the tape and how many boxes you use.

[Rob Colatutto]

is a 5 pound box stops a robot....then that is pretty sad

[Mongoose]

I'm not talking about stopping, I'm talking about deflecting or diverting so its path will be skewed.

[Jnadke]

Yes, and no.

Remember, the bins have to placed on the playing field so that the "lid" side is up. They cannot be placed in any other position.

In this orientation, the bins have the least amount of friction, so I doubt you will skew the robot's path.

But, as for placing a bin in front of a robot, yes, that is perfectly legal. I was thinking about that strategy too. If someone programs their robot to look for reflective tape in an attempt to knock over human player container stack(s), you could put a bin in front of it to fool it.

[Rob Colatutto]

we ran a test today...and one human player can barely pick up the 4 crates, walk 12 feet, and put them down and come back in 10 seconds.... this was done walking fastly, so its not going to be very possible to make any big stacks like they said you could

[Chris Nowak]

So teams with stronger members are going to be able to stack them better? That seems somewhat unfair and runs parallel to sports in my opinion, even if it is a small part of the game. Well, they did emphasize that the game wasnt gonna be fair.

[Ben Mitchell]

What??

Come on - there has got to be SOME member of every team that has some upper body strength.

I don't see that as much of a problem - they aren't too heavy, just bulky. (at least for me)

[Don Knight]

Originally posted by Jnadke

Remember, the bins have to placed on the playing field so that the "lid" side is up. They cannot be placed in any other position.

Carefully read rule GM18 - it states that "human player containers must be "stacked" with the bottom side facing down.

It doesn't say parallel with the floor.

Up would > than a 90 degree angle

Perpendicular would be = 90 degrees

Down would be < than a 90 degree angle

A "stack" has already been defined as one tote.

So then, if a tote was laying on it's side or end, the bottom would be facing down.

Wouldn't it?

[Johca_Gaorl]

Originally posted by Don Knight
Carefully read rule GM18 - it states that "human player containers must be "stacked" with the bottom side facing down.

So then, if a tote was laying on it's side or end, the bottom would be facing down.

Wouldn't it?

Come on, I think it's obvious what they meant, i.e. not on their side etc. Do we have to find a loophole in everything?

[Don Knight]

Originally posted by Johca_Gaorl
Come on, I think it's obvious what they meant, i.e. not on their side etc. Do we have to find a loophole in everything?

I have no idea what they meant, but I do know the difference between "facing down" and "parallel to the floor".

Its our job to follow the rules as "written" not to figure out what someone may have meant.

Careful interpretation of the rules is not cheating, its called finding an edge.

Remember the "Tape Measure Rule"?

[Johca_Gaorl]

Facing means the two "planes" persay are parallel

you described "pointing" down.

And no I don't know about the tape measure rule, I'm new this year, I just learn fast

[Pengiun Joe]

Originally posted by Don Knight
Carefully read rule GM18 - it states that "human player containers must be "stacked" with the bottom side facing down.

It doesn't say parallel with the floor.

Up would > than a 90 degree angle

Perpendicular would be = 90 degrees

Down would be < than a 90 degree angle

A "stack" has already been defined as one tote.

So then, if a tote was laying on it's side or end, the bottom would be facing down.

Wouldn't it?

I think that the spirit of the rule is that the box has to sit with the bottom flat on the ground. As for the discussion on placing stacks directly in front of robots, one thing my team considered was placing them a quarter of the way in front of the ramp. The robot could still see the reflective tape, but it would draw a straight line to its target - right through the plexiglass siding.

[Don Knight]

Originally posted by Pengiun Joe
I think that the spirit of the rule is that the box has to sit with the bottom flat on the ground. As for the discussion on placing stacks directly in front of robots, one thing my team considered was placing them a quarter of the way in front of the ramp. The robot could still see the reflective tape, but it would draw a straight line to its target - right through the plexiglass siding.

As far as GM18 - I guess I just interpret the rule differently.

As far as containers on ramps -

Human Player cannot place containers on the ramps:

GM16 - .....They will have 10 seconds to place or stack their containers within their own scoring zone. The ramp is not a scoring zone.