The 1 bin confusion.....

[sanddrag]

Originally posted by nwagers
since when do measurements start at one? all the rulers in my house begin with 0. the way the rules(update) read all the tubs are counted down, so unless you can stack enough tubs on their sides to add a complete SHU it does nothing to your multiplier

We just need to know for sure if the stick starts at 1 or zero.

[Madison]

Originally posted by sanddrag
1 SHU = 14 3/4 inches. 1 bin in standard position is 15 3/4 high. So according to the SHU stick starting with 1, a bin would be above the 2 mark already.

Will someone clarify all of this really simply please?

Imagine that the SHU measuring stick were the X-Axis of a graph. The question, really, is where is the zero of that graph. Is it at floor level, or is it one SHU below floor level.

By the previous descriptions of scoring, the zero was one SHU below floor level. FIRST has changed this so that it now rests at floor level.

<14.75" = 0 (i.e., no bin, broken bins, etc.)
14.75"-29.50" = 1 (a single bin, at 15.75", falls into this category)
etc.

This is clear when you consider why they lowered the SHU measurement to 14.75". See, if the floor were 1, it would be as you said, and a single bin would be 2 SHUs tall. But, since the floor is 0, that single bin is now 1 SHU tall. Furthermore, with an SHU of 15.75", and while rounding down, two nested bins would not be tall enough to break the 31.5" threshold and would round down to be a stack of 1.

The new SHU measurement, coupled with the change to rounding down makes a lot of sense. I get it now. I like it better this way. One bin should count as one bin, regardless of its orientation.

[illumanat'i]

"Fractional stack heights are rounded down to the nearest SHU"
- Team Update #1 so non-dispudable

One SHU is one bin's height

using basic logic, (which FIRST has been known to ignore):
1 bin = 1 SHU, and since everything gets rounded down, a bin on its side, 1.5 bins = 1.5 SHUs, which turns into 1 SHU...

I am NOT sure of any of this, it is just my reading of the facts, and is open to dispute, especially as the team update also says SHUs are 14 3/4" high measurements, when bins are 15 3/4" high in the rule book.

<edit> according M. Krass above this post, the measurements make sense... i didn't do the math, but it sounds like he did, and i'm currently to tired to figure it out </edit>

[sanddrag]

If I can take your word that the stick starts at 0, then a ruling has been made. 1 bin will count for 1 in any orientation (which really sucks because that's not the way Woody presented it at kickoff) Can you confirm for certain that the stick starts at 0? Also, your stack will count for how many bins are in it unless you are able to stack enough on their side that it raises the stack a height of one whole bin. (highly unlikely)

Originally posted by M. Krass
Furthermore, with an SHU of 15.75", and while rounding down, two nested bins would not be tall enough to break the 31.5" threshold and would round down to be a stack of 1.

Just so no one has a heart attack, the real SHU is 14.75. Krass was saying IF right there.

[illumanat'i]

WHAT?? two bins count as one? what the hell is going on,

oh, my arm, it hurts, i think i'm having a heart att----v/\v----v/\v---- ---- ----

[sanddrag]

Originally posted by illumanat'i
One SHU is one bin's height

No it doesn't. One SHU = one nested bin height. So one bin on the ground in standard position would break the 14.75 barrier, and be rounded down to 1.

[skittle5]

the way you get the scor of boxes is, count the number of boxes in your scoring area even if they are in the stack, subtract the height of the stack from the total number of bins on your side, in this case since you say that it will be a stack counting as four and there are seven boxes in your scoring area, all of these boxes are in the pyramid, so you subtract four from seven and that gives you three, and since you have a hieght of four you times three by four and the score of the pyramid is 12, trust me dave lavery is on my team

[sanddrag]

Originally posted by illumanat'i
WHAT?? two bins count as one? what the hell is going on,

oh, my arm, it hurts, i think i'm having a heart att----v/\v----v/\v---- ---- ----

At this point I'd like to remind everyone to read an entire thread before posting false assumptions such as this.

[skittle5]

i would just like to say that if a bin is on its side then it counts as a stack of two if you have 2 bins and one on its side this will count as no points because you have a bin that counts as two and a total of two bins 2-2=0, 2*0=0 so it counts as none

[sanddrag]

Originally posted by skittle5
i would just like to say that if a bin is on its side then it counts as a stack of two if you have 2 bins and one on its side this will count as no points because you have a bin that counts as two and a total of two bins 2-2=0, 2*0=0 so it counts as none

No, no no no no no no. READ BEFORE YOU POST!

[skittle5]

david lavery is on my team and he says that if a bin is on it's side then it counts as two

[sanddrag]

Originally posted by skittle5
david lavery is on my team and he says that if a bin is on it's side then it counts as two

dave?

[skittle5]

Originally posted by sanddrag
dave?

David (dave) Lavery you know one of the peoplewho made the game, that one

[sanddrag]

When I said dave? I meant does he have anything to say about this. I know who he is. And now I will abide by this

You also agree not to ..... use the forums as a real-time chat, continuing a 2-3 person conversation on for numerious posts in a short period of time.

and end this discussion.

[skittle5]

agreed