Water Game Next Year?

[legogeek24]

I remember water hints being dropped in previous years as well, obviously to no avail. As *interesting* as it would be, I'm sure its a myth being perpetuated for the frustration of everyone

[jblay]

I remember in 09 when the hint was a fish. And then they unveiled the field and it was white and not carpet and I had serious freak out moment where I said to myself, "holy @!#$ they did a water game." Please FIRST don't do this. Of course 2013 will definitely be the year of the water game.

[KevinGoneNuts]

Originally Posted by jblay

I remember in 09 when the hint was a fish. And then they unveiled the field and it was white and not carpet and I had serious freak out moment where I said to myself, "holy @!#$ they did a water game." Please FIRST don't do this. Of course 2013 will definitely be the year of the water game.

well that was one of Dave Lavery's hints... His are always so out of the ordinary... Now with him (sadly) not on the GDC anymore We wont have any of those. 2012 was an example of this. We got a list of materials for the field, and we almost got it

But with this year also being a sport year, the next year will be completely random, so something relating to water, but not water itself, is possible.

[Mk.32]

For anyone that wants to build an ROV...

http://www.auvsi.org/foundation/competitions/robosub/

[Rangel]

Originally Posted by Mk.32

For anyone that wants to build an ROV...

http://www.auvsi.org/foundation/competitions/robosub/

Yes I strongly say that this water game is better than any water game FIRST can come up with given their limited size, space, and cost. It was a great experience for us and I encourage all teams to take a look at this competition. If all autonomous is too much to take on so soon you can also do Nurc which is teleoperated and at night:

http://arizonapromotersofappliedscie...m/default.aspx

[tsaksa]

How about a simulated water game? Imagine the robots looking for and manipulating game pieces in an arena that is approximately six inches deep in ping pong balls, or squash balls, etc. You can see the top of your robot, but the game pieces and obsolesces and perhaps even the goals are fully or partially obscured by a vast number of non scoring pieces. The shear weight and volume of them present unique challenges both for navigation and locating the real scoring pieces.

[qzrrbz]

Originally Posted by tsaksa

How about a simulated water game? Imagine the robots looking for and manipulating game pieces in an arena that is approximately six inches deep in ping pong balls, or squash balls, etc. You can see the top of your robot, but the game pieces and obsolesces and perhaps even the goals are fully or partially obscured by a vast number of non scoring pieces. The shear weight and volume of them present unique challenges both for navigation and locating the real scoring pieces.

Remind me not to sign up for "field reset" on this one!

[MrForbes]

I had a nice conversation with Bill Miller this year, and the subject of water did come up.

NURC is fun, and this year we get to try the autonomous version! based on the RoboSub rules

[Samwaldo]

First of all a water game is impractical!!!! If the venue even allowed a field with water on it, then FIRST field set up would have to figure a way to transport water to the field, probably being buckets if a hose was not long enough. Also leakage would be a huge problem. Lastly putting away a wet field would Be difficult due to slippage but also FIRST volunteers would have to figure a way to get rid of the water.

I think though if they ABSOLUTLY wanted to do something with water then they could do something similar to the 2011 minibots, they could put a small lane, or bowl of water that involves a minibot either racing down the lane of water, or floating in a bowl and doing something

[Taylor]

Bill Miller said a similar thing at QCR. The crowd was awash in speculation, but I suspect he was dripping with sarcasm.

[fox46]

I don't think water is as impractical as it is being made out to be. As far as the motors and battery etc are concerned, they will operate quite happily fully immersed in water (relatively clean water). Water as a matter of fact is non-conductive, rather it is the ions present in the water that account for the conductive nature. However, for driving motors and higher current loads, the power leak through the water is negligable. In fact, I have read several articles stating that the best way to break in one of the mabuchi-style motors is to immerse it in a glass of water and run it at low power for up to an hour. The problem with water and motors is corrosion which would have to be mitigated with sacrificial anodes or chemical inhibitors. The only trickky bit would be the electronics as they are indeed affected by current leak through water. FIRST would have to design and provide a waterproof control system. Something as simple as a waterproof Pelican case fitted with amphenol connectors or thru-case terminal strips would work quite well. An even cheaper solution would be military surplus ammunition boxes (cost about $5 each at surplus outlets) fitted with a lexan window to view the blinking lights and thru-case terminal strips for input/output connections. I know a number of people who have built waterproof cases for camcorders using these boxes. Model RC boats seem to do just fine so why not robots??

As for the venue, I think the only place you will have issues are gymnasiums with hardwood floors. Convention centers and arenas will have no problem dealing with water due to concrete construction and floor drains. Heck- in Toronto they flood an arena 5 feet deep and drive powerboats around towwing wakeboarders for the Toronto Boat Show! I have also attended several events where organizers have set up above-ground pools to hold mock RC warship battles and such. It's not out of the question IMO. Such a field could be filled from any standpipe or fire hose in no time and drained using a portable gasoline utility pump outside into a storm drain.

I do however think that FIRST is too "lazy" to pull something like this off. It is just so much easier for them not to bother.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by fox46

I don't think water is as impractical as it is being made out to be.

Yes, it is....

I do however think that FIRST is too "lazy" to pull something like this off. It is just so much easier for them not to bother.

I think there's a difference between being realistic, and being lazy. Although they often go together.

[Libby K]

Originally Posted by Taylor

Bill Miller said a similar thing at QCR. The crowd was awash in speculation, but I suspect he was dripping with sarcasm.

Oh good, the puns are back.

Originally Posted by EricH

1993. Some of the balls on the field had water inside.

Okay, so I guess the idea of 'we've never had a water game' is sunk.

[z_beeblebrox]

A water game would be awesome (especially with our mentors http://selectric.org/nurc12/index.html), but it won't happen.

[sodizzle]

Originally Posted by Samwaldo

First of all a water game is impractical!!!! If the venue even allowed a field with water on it, then FIRST field set up would have to figure a way to transport water to the field, probably being buckets if a hose was not long enough. Also leakage would be a huge problem. Lastly putting away a wet field would Be difficult due to slippage but also FIRST volunteers would have to figure a way to get rid of the water.

Exactly, plus teams would have to practice somehow. Rookie teams that year would be absolutely screwed. Not every team has the ability to have a pool for them to practice in. Then even the teams that might be allowed to use a pool, say from a local YMCA, could not be allowed to have it isolated for as long as they would need it to practice. For safety reasons (electricity and water) there would not be anyone in the water with the robot. I just don't see a water game in any form ever happening.