Einstein Field issues Handled correctly?

[Nuttyman54]

I would like to start off by congratulating 180, 25 and 16 on their win and performance, it was an absolutely awesome alliance to behold.

Regarding the handling of Einstein...I felt like there may have been a better way to handle it, but I don't have a solution for how to do it better, other than to give more time to the field crew by running awards consecutively, and possibly not to crown a champion. I do understand, however, that there were very limited options. I understand it's supposed to be a "show", but honestly, proceeding with a tournament which is obviously flawed is a pretty bad show. Ultimately, however, there was no good solution. Everyone lost on Einstein because it was impossible to play fair matches. I hold the utmost respect and trust for the veteran crew that was running Einstein, and I believe they did everything in their power to fix it, but at that point things were moving too fast and the problem was too far out of their hands to reasonably do anything else. The decision was made to move on, and I know everyone on the field at the time understood the implications of that decision.

The problem with admitting that there is a serious issue that cannot be resolved is that it throws doubt on the entire season. These problems have been happening since week 1, and to admit on Einstein that the issues were not, in fact, able to be fixed by teams means that everyone who experience this issue at some point during the season would feel cheated.

The problem with proceeding with play is that people will forever question the legitimacy. There is no doubt in my mind that all 4 of the alliances on Einstein had a legitimate shot at the championship, and they all exhibited phenomenal play throughout their divisions. While the outcome may have been the same, I think everyone including the teams on the field will agree that Einstein was decided by the system issues, not by the alliances' play, and that is a real shame.

Ultimately, the solution is for FIRST not to ignore the problems like this when they first start cropping up, and make a concentrated effort to diagnose and resolve them as soon as possible, instead of proceeding with the status quo that anything which can't be diagnosed from the field must be a robot problem. This was not an isolated incident, it was a widespread problem. Enough so that I predicted on Thursday (and several people can quote me as such) that every single finals matchup played would have a dead robot during at least part of it. I don't know if it came entirely true, but the fact that I was right for Archimedes, Curie (I heard Newton had a dead 68 as well, but I didn't personally witness it) and Einstein means that something is very very wrong. That doesn't even count other dead robots during quarters and semis like 330 and 1717.

I would never EVER wish for this to happen to a team, but at the very least, FIRST is now recognizing that they need to take a much closer look at the system. I expect this problem will not happen next year.

The last point I want to make is similar to what Kevin Sevcik said earlier. This may or may not be a "field" problem, and it may or may not be a "robot" problem, but it is very definitely and obviously something which many many top teams and engineers have not been able to diagnose and do not have the ability to fix. There is a problem with the control system and it is something the teams do not currently have any way to prevent from happening, because nobody can tell them how to fix it. This, to me, is inexcusable. I don't care if FMS says everything is working fine, if the best teams in FRC are having that many problems and NOBODY can tell them why, you can't just tell the teams "tough, it's not our end so it has to be yours". I mean no slight to the FTA's, they were just following protocol and doing their best job to diagnose things on the fly. I mean in the sense that FIRST has not publicly expressed any concern or attempt to resolve the problems. If they had been, I really wish they had been public about it.

I know NI has been looking at reports of these issues throughout the season and trying to root out the problem, but I haven't heard what their theories are and if there's any known solution. Likewise, I don't know if their investigation was prompted internally after seeing it at events, or by FIRST.

TL;DR, FIRST needed to be more transparent and proactive about addressing the issues throughout the season. It was apparent to many people that there was a serious problem, but by the time it surfaced on Einstein, there was no good solution.

Originally Posted by Kit Gerhart

1) One of the division fields could be used as Einstein for the "superfinals." It would have been well-tested after running over 150 matches. To my knowledge, we had no field-related issues on the Curie field during 3 days of play. If i'm wrong on that, please correct me.

Originally Posted by thefro526

Kit, I believe you are correct. As far as I am aware, the only team that had multiple issues with their robot not running on the field was 971, and the issue was on their end IIRC.

971 experience the same symptoms as exhibited on Einstein during several of our matches on Curie, and we were unable to diagnose the issue, just like everyone else. I'm not particularly familiar with the control system so I can't share many details, but we never determined the root cause of the problem. It may or may not be the same as what other teams experienced. Saying the issues was "on our end" is the same thing teams have been told all season. "Our end" doesn't mean "our fault" or that we had the ability to fix it. We worked in our quarterfinals matches, but we don't know why.

78 also died in F1, but I can't speak to the cause either.