Driver selection

[sg999]

Hi,
How do you guys choose your drivers? When do you choose your drivers? How often do you change your drive team? What types of criteria are used (such as senority, ability, maturity, etc)? I'm asking because we chose our drive team very late this year, and we're looking for ways to efficiently and fairly choose a drive team, so any input at all would be very helpful.
Thanks

[smurfgirl]

There are a ton of threads here that discuss this at length - you might want to search around a bit and read some of the great thoughts that have already been shared.

Here are my thoughts on the issue, taken from this thread just over four years ago. I think Team 1124 is still following more or less the same approach now as we were then.

1) First, we determine who is interested in driving. The students who are interested in driving all get an equal opportunity to practice on old robots to get used to driving the base, as well as on our prototype robot, to practice whatever functions are exclusive to each game. We build two robots (one for practice), so we extend this process past when we have shipped the competition bot. A week or two before regionals, we decide on our official drive team. There are some important characteristics that must be taken into consideration:

- Drivers must listen to the coach at all times
- Drivers must work well with each other (good chemistry)
- Drivers must exercise good judgment- we don't want to see reckless or stupid driving on the field
- Drivers must be agile and quick
- Drivers must have a good handle on the rules and game play
- Drivers must have a decent idea of basic strategies the coach will use
- Drivers must know how the robot works
- Drivers must follow all team rules, since they are the most "visible" people during a competition
- Drivers must have x hours of practice on that year's robot (it varies from year to year)

Writing those things out, it seems like we're ridiculously harsh in our driver selection process, but we're not super-rigid about rules. Students who are motivated to read the rules, get familiar with the robot, act appropriately, and practice driving have a good shot at qualifying.

We also choose a back-up drive team, (the next two people who qualify based on these criteria). The back-up drive team is used for if the primary drivers are sick, need a break, are not on their game, etc.

2) We use a similar selection process for coaches (we only do student coaches). Once we've figured out who is interested, they train by instructing the drivers who are practicing on the different robots. Again, there are a lot of characteristics we would like to see in a coach:

- Coach must work well with drive team (good chemistry)
- Coach must be able to think quickly and rationally
- Coach must be able to exercise good judgment in tricky scenarios
- Coach must stay calm and level-headed- no panicking, and no screaming at the drivers
- Coach must have an excellent handle on the rules in the manual- our coaches usually know the rules down to the wording, and the number of the rule (like <G42>)
- Coach must understand game play, and have some pre-determined strategies laid out
- Coach must work well with scouting team to determine strategies based on partners/opponents
- Coach must spend time watching other regionals and analyzing game play to better our own
- Coach must know how the robot works
- Coach must follow all team rules, since (s)he is the most "visible" person during a competition

Again, even though it seems like a lot of rigid stuff listed out, it's not too hard to fit most of these criteria if you actually try. We also choose a back-up coach, (the next person who qualifies based on these criteria). The back-up coach is used for if the primary coach is sick, needs a break, is not on his/her game, etc.

3) As you can tell, we have two drivers. One controls the base of the robot, and one controls whatever game-related piece we have on the robot, like an arm, a claw, an elevator, a shooter, etc. It's easier to split up the tasks so that each person can focus on their own part.

Edit: I thought of something else you might want to take into consideration. You mentioned the stress of the competition as a factor in why your driver selection wasn't quite right. When our drivers are practicing, we crank up distracting music really loud, have our spirit team cheering, spectators, and other various people around the area to simulate a competition. It does distract the drivers a lot, and it definitely helps to prepare them for competition. Also, if you have old robot, you might want to have people driving those robots as well as the new one to "get in the way" just like you'd see at a competition.

...I can't believe how much time I must have had four years ago. I don't think I'd have the patience to type this much out anymore!

[mega900997]

We select our driver team based on seniority and experience. We make sure as well that there is at least one programming, wiring, and mechanical person on the drive team to diagnose any problems we have on the field. For the next couple of years, we hope to change it up a bit.

[Samwaldo]

It's different every year how we chose a drive team..

In 2011 we chose the partners that picked up 3 tubes and deployed the mini not the fastest.

In 2012 we chose the partners that picked up the most basketballs and shot them. Also whoever was most smooth and fast with balancing. (we had a different drive team for the 2 regionals we went to because 2 groups were so even.

We also include how well the drivers work together and cooperate, because it's easier to master driving than teaching two ppl to work together.

When you chose is another whole thing!!! Our tryouts included about a week of practicing (probably around 4hrs for each team), and then 2 days of tryouts.

If you have a practice bot or even just a chassis (this year you could practice balancing with just a chassis) then you want to do it as soon as possible!

[carrillo694]

Originally Posted by Samwaldo

It's different every year how we chose a drive team..

In 2011 we chose the partners that picked up 3 tubes and deployed the mini not the fastest.

In 2012 we chose the partners that picked up the most basketballs and shot them. Also whoever was most smooth and fast with balancing. (we had a different drive team for the 2 regionals we went to because 2 groups were so even.

We also include how well the drivers work together and cooperate, because it's easier to master driving than teaching two ppl to work together.

When you chose is another whole thing!!! Our tryouts included about a week of practicing (probably around 4hrs for each team), and then 2 days of tryouts.

If you have a practice bot or even just a chassis (this year you could practice balancing with just a chassis) then you want to do it as soon as possible!

How did you make different "drive team" configurations? Did the students take it upon themselves to partner up with a friend to vie for the position? Were these (potential) partnerships designed by some higher authority?

[Ekcrbe]

Our emphasis is on not only who can do one thing, but who can do multiple things on the drive team. For example, our manipulator operator was the second -best chassis driver,* and the inbounder was a combination of third-best driver and best inbounder* (it was convenient that our inbounder was both of those, so we could chose without compromise*). Our backup drivers are backup for any position on the team, not just one specifically. If either the driver or operator is out, the backup driver takes on manipulator duties and (when applicable) the manipulator operator takes the chassis. The backup human player is the same as the backup driver to provide as much consistency as possible within the unit. Our coach is always a mentor. We get tryouts in during build season with an old chassis so we can start practicing as soon as a manipulator is ready and on the practice bot.

One last thing to note is that you need to practice not only with your best drive unit, but also mix in the backups one at a time to practice any possible configuration that could come up in a competition. You wouldn't want head out for a match with someone driving in an unfamiliar position or with an untested driver-manipulator partnership.

*Based on driving time-trials and inbounding accuracy tryouts.

[Gray Adams]

We did time trials on a few obstacle courses. The tryouts were fairly casual, and the driver with the best time gets to drive the chassis. Because this year was an all new drive team, we had primary driver pick the secondary driver and coach. This works out pretty well because everyone is pretty much guaranteed to work well together. We haven't had any issues in the last 4 years at least with the driver with the best time being someone unsuitable for the position (difficult to work with, not able to handle the pressure, or anything like that), so we haven't had to come up with other criteria to pick a new driver.

Next year, since I'm graduating, our secondary driver (junior) is going to spend some practicing with me before we hold another tryout. It may seem a little unfair that they're going to get this extra practice time going into the tryouts, but really the tryouts are just to make sure there isn't anyone better than our incumbent drive team member. If anyone wants to practice, they're welcome to as well, but most people don't. The way I ended up being driver was pretty much all due to desire. I had the worst, and I mean absolute worst time on the time trial the first time I drove it. It was a horrendous 2 minutes on a roughly 35 second course. So I spent the next week practicing for 1.5 hours or so per day, and by the end my time was down to 30 seconds. If that's how other drivers become the best too, the nature of their personality is probably a good fit for drive team with dedication like that.

[Billfred]

We had the same driver (and often the same operator) our first three years; both had to go and graduate after last year, so it was basically open call this year.

There were no official tryouts with this year's robot (we bagged a robot with a dead cRIO), so we plunked a Vex controller into last year's and drove it around. We knew it was not a true simulation (long base versus wide, different sprocket reduction and wheels, Cortex controller versus the driver station), but it helped us see who had the right mindset.

We took into account other things (reliability, personality, dedication, general "it" factor), and the mentors huddled and made our decisions. Human player was tag-teamed a bit, but our driver, operator, and field coach (our graduated driver now at USC) stayed constant over our season.

After coaching Peachtree and part of Championship last year, I was a little reluctant to give up the button, so I did pull our drivers aside at times to make sure our new coach was making the transition well. With good reports there, I left him to it.

My personal stance is that the field coach runs the drive team (and has a measure of control over the pit). Whether it's talking strategy, switching out a job, or making a change to the robot, it goes through him.

$0.03 (darn inflation)

[Tori]

For us the seniority doesn't matter much. Who ever is the best gets the position. We would rater have the best drive team possible. We do try-outs and the best wins. We base everything on skill, how well they can work together and their mannerisms. If they are hyper and high strung they are less likely to get picked over people who tend to be calmer and more rational.

[dag0620]

While 1071 doesn't have an exact formal protocol, we do have a mostly fleshed out process that we use to select our drivers.

Typically if one is interested in driving, they usually start the season prior doing as much driving as possible during off-season events. If someone is showing extra talent early on, they'll be responsible for all driving at WIWI (An off-season our team hosts). While none of this is part of the formal process, it's pretty much assumed that you need to go through off-season driving to get sirusly considered.

As soon as one of the robots are built, any interested drivers begin practicing as our mentors watch. Perspective Human Players also begin practicing during this time. We then hold the final try-outs at the Suffield Shakedown, as we can see the perspective drivers in actual matches. After that the mentors meet the night of the event, and decided who will be our Drive Team for that year.

Some other things we take into consideration when picking a Drive Team:
-It is a team rule that students can't be on Drive Team their first year.
-It is also a team rule that the Coach must be a student, and not a mentor.
-Although not a rule, Coaches are typically expected to have been a driver in a prior season.

Like I said before, it's not the most formal way of doing it, but it has worked for us, and has produced some pretty good results.

[sg999]

Thanks guys, this will definitely help with driver selection for next year. We'll certainly try to implement these ideas into driver selection for next year. Also, who exactly is it that has the final say on drivers? And how often do you change your drivers, as in are they different people each year or are they the same for all four years? How much time does your drive team practice after being selected?

[smurfgirl]

It depends what works for you, really... if you have a very student-run team, you might want to have students have the final say in driver selection. The mentors/adults can probably be more objective, though, since it's not their friends they're dealing with. The more objective you can make the selection process the better.

We redo the selection process each season, but often people end up driving for more than one season because they are the best fit for the position more than one year. I definitely think it makes sense to allow everyone interested to get a chance each season, but it would not be surprising if the most qualified person is the same for more than one year. You don't want to switch your drive team too frequently (multiple times per competition season, for example), though, because they won't have had as much time to practice driving or play in competition, and you also risk other teams losing familiarity with your drivers.

Practice is an incredibly important factor in success at the competitions. You want your drivers to have an innate feel for the robot so that they can operate it smoothly and focus executing your strategies, rather than trying to figure out how to pick up and maneuver the game piece for the first time. Successful teams may often have hundreds of hours of driver practice. The more you can practice, the better, especially if you can closely simulate competition (with other robots pestering you, full-size field, loud music, spectators, etc.). Since you're in CT, attending the Suffield Shakedown and other informal scrimmages/playdates with other teams is a great way to get some of this practice. You can also do it in your meeting place by getting a backup drive team operating a previous year's robot and playing defense with loud music in the background. Whatever you can do will help a lot.

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by sg999

Thanks guys, this will definitely help with driver selection for next year. We'll certainly try to implement these ideas into driver selection for next year. Also, who exactly is it that has the final say on drivers? And how often do you change your drivers, as in are they different people each year or are they the same for all four years? How much time does your drive team practice after being selected?

1) The mentors huddle and reach consensus...but usually the kids make it easy for us by only having a couple of contenders.
2) A driver from a previous year has a natural advantage when we select the following year's drive team, though it isn't a lock. During the competitions themselves, I think I've pulled a driver once for an attitude check in all the years I've coached.

[Samwaldo]

Originally Posted by carrillo694

How did you make different "drive team" configurations? Did the students take it upon themselves to partner up with a friend to vie for the position? Were these (potential) partnerships designed by some higher authority?

On my team, the students pick there driving partner (that way you can be with a friend or someone you enjoy workin with. That way the whole experience is fun, which is what FIRST is all about. Then between the partners decide who wants to be driver 1, and who wants to be driver 2.

[Mark Sheridan]

I have followed 1114 guidelines for picking a driver. I try to pick students who are mature, good under pressure, deep knowledge of the inner workings of the robot, good communication, and committed to to give everything they got. I also like at least one driver that can program as well. 3309 was very lucky to pull off a practice robot this year. The drivers I picked this year were very determined to practice. They would set up our practice area after school before the mentors even showed up.

I avoid driver trials because I don't think they are a good measure of a drivers potential. A good driver needs to practice and develop over time. One trial won't show me anything. I try to find students who will become good drivers.

I did this also when I was on 766. In 2005 we accidentally did this. I was a high school senior at the time and we pretty much knew who our driver was before the build season. We may have had a drivers trial, but I distinctly remember we chose our driver for his contributions during the season, his knowledge of the game, and his cool under pressure. It was a good choice because it was 766's best season ever. The 2006-2007 driver was picked under similar circumstances.

However in 2008, pressure from students and parents forced a return of the driver trials. This lead to a student who "won" who was un-coachable, panicky and unfocused. I think the current method was reestablished in 766 on the 2010 season which also was the toughest driver selection i ever was part of. I had two really good students who wanted the be the drivetrain operator. I wound up using a race to act as a tie breaker but I still feel bad that I had to make that difficult choice.

I hope for 3309 in the fall to use an off season event and a practice chassis to see who has potential. I already have a short list of potential students who I think can be on the drive team. If we ever start up a vex team or two, the selection pool should be very intreasting.