Wheres the camera?

[Jengles]

This is my team's rookie year, and we thought we would receive an axis camera this year for the image recognition. It was not in either of the totes nor the KOP list but it was on the WPI website for being part of the hardware provided? http://wpilib.screenstepslive.com/s/...dware-overview . Will we have to buy one on our own?

[JohnSchneider]

I believe it became a first choice item. I do not know the status on how many are in stock. Otherwise, yes, you will have to buy one.

[Jengles]

Originally Posted by animenerdjohn

I believe it became a first choice item. I do not know the status on how many are in stock. Otherwise, yes, you will have to buy one.

Im sorry but whats a first choice item?

[CalTran]

Originally Posted by Jengles

Im sorry but whats a first choice item?

FIRST CHOICE

[slijin]

FIRST Choice is a program run by Andymark where you are allotted a certain number of credits to receive items donated by FIRST sponsors - i.e. they're free; only cost is shipping. All teams received 200 credits, 100 when the system was opened and another 100 yesterday during kickoff.

FIRSTChoice login information can be found in your TIMS account after FIRST receives your registration payment.

You log in to and order the items here.

The camera is out of stock but there's still plenty of stuff to snatch up.

The link you provided is to a site that discusses common FIRST setups, and as the camera was included in the KoP for rookies for the past three years and has its own wiring setup, it was mentioned there. You will, therefore as you inferred, have to buy your own or use a sponsor's PDV to obtain it.

[Jimmy Nichols]

They are out of stock on first choice.

[clandry94]

Why don't they include the camera and certain other parts in the rookie kit anymore? Many rookie teams, like this one here, don't know about FIRST Choice and it's impossible for them to get something like a camera for less than normal value before it's too late.

[slijin]

Originally Posted by clandry94

Why don't they include the camera and certain other parts in the rookie kit anymore? Many rookie teams, like this one here, don't know about FIRST Choice and it's impossible for them to get something like a camera for less than normal value before it's too late.

Remember that FIRST pays little, if anything, for the material stocked in the KoP. Most KoP supplies are donated by FIRST sponsors; the first variety of Axis cameras that were distributed were surplus following its discontinuation; the second variety was both part sponsorship, part surplus. Once Axis stopped donating, FIRST had no supply to give to teams.

[Tangert]

As A rookie as well I am wondering what camera should we use, the new Axis M1013? or are their their other cameras that enable better use of the vision targets?

[slijin]

Originally Posted by Tangert

As A rookie as well I am wondering what camera should we use, the new Axis M1013? or are their their other cameras that enable better use of the vision targets?

This question has already been brought up and discussed.

For lack of a definitive answer, I would recommend trying to purchase either the M1011 or the 206, for ease of troubleshooting. Barring that however, per Greg's answer in that thread, try the M1013.

[Greg McKaskle]

If you intend to use a camera with WPILib, I'd either purchase an Axis 206 or M1011 from an existing team, or purchase the M1013 through AndyMark or another retailer.

I say "if", because you are able to experiment with the vision examples even without a camera. FIRST provided image files of the field targets to help get an example of how they work and the info they provide back to the robot. This allows you to learn a bit about the utility of the camera before investing in one. The other benefit of the camera, of course, is to give the driver an image feed.

If your team decides it doesn't need either of these, you can spend the money somewhere else. Please don't get me wrong. I think image processing presents a great learning opportunity for teams of all experience levels, and I'm sad to see it not be in the KOP, but I won't declare it as a must have purchase either. I think one of the values of FIRST is to dispel the CSI style of pseudo-babble that poses as science, and I feel that the camera pretty quickly brings reality back into the picture. They are very useful sensors, but not magical.

Greg McKaskle

[Tangert]

Thank you a bunch. We are on information overload here as rookies. Its really fun.

[dcarr]

Originally Posted by clandry94

Many rookie teams, like this one here, don't know about FIRST Choice and it's impossible for them to get something like a camera for less than normal value before it's too late.

While staying on top of the barrage of emails can be a challenge, the Main Contact should have received many pieces of communication detailing the process for FIRST Choice over the past several months. That's kind of like saying "it's not fair that there are so many rules for the teams who don't bother to read the manual."

[billylo]

Greg>> FIRST provided image files of the field targets to help get an example of how they work

Hi, Greg, would you mind sending us a pointer to these sample image files? I am unable to find them on USFIRST.org or CD... Thanks! Billy.

[billylo]

Or are you referring the samples here?

http://wpilib.screenstepslive.com/s/...ng-the-targets

Thanks. Billy.