Climbing Rules

[jason701802]

Originally Posted by 3.1.5 (or 3.2.4 in the PDF)

Points are awarded to ALLIANCES per the details below. Final scores will be assessed five (5) seconds after the ARENA timer displays zero (0) or when all elements come to rest, whichever event happens first.

I think that makes it pretty clear that the official score is based on the position of the robot(s) (and Frisbees) 5 seconds after the end of the match

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by jason701802

I think that makes it pretty clear that the official score is based on the position of the robot(s) (and Frisbees) 5 seconds after the end of the match

I agree, and assume they'll clarify early on.

[ScottOliveira]

So I have a thought concerning the legality of grabbing the second bar while on the ground.

You'll note that the rules specify:

A ROBOT has CLIMBED its PYRAMID if it contacts the PYRAMID in
A. sequential order (Level 0, 1, 2, 3) during ascent and
B. no more than two (2) Levels simultaneously.

However the Pyramid is defined as

PYRAMID: the Red or Blue steel structure on which ROBOTS CLIMB for points.

The carpet beneath the period is not a part of the steel structure, and therefore not a part of the defined pyramid. So, as long as you were to contact the Level 1 structure first, it could be legal to grab on to the Level 2 structure, while being in contact with the carpet, as you are not contacting the pyramid itself in Level 0.

That may not be intent of the rules, but the wording is very strange. The pyramid is defined as just the steel structure, and doesn't mention including the carpet beneath. And given that Figure 3-4 seems to show Level 0 as being below the actual structure of the pyramid, is it even possible to contact the pyramid in Level 0? Perhaps a rewording of 3.1.5.2 is necessary?

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by ScottOliveira

So I have a thought concerning the legality of grabbing the second bar while on the ground.

It's been noted. I'm sure it will be clarified quickly in the Q&A or team updates!

[Redo91]

I am unable to find the blog post where Frank discusses it, but this sounds like "lawyering". The intent, I believe, is for the robot to be supported only by the individual level before moving on to the next level.

Of course, a Q&A submission and team updates will say for sure what the ruling on this is.

[ScottOliveira]

Originally Posted by Redo91

I am unable to find the blog post where Frank discusses it, but this sounds like "lawyering". The intent, I believe, is for the robot to be supported only by the individual level before moving on to the next level.

Of course, a Q&A submission and team updates will say for sure what the ruling on this is.

No disagreement from me, I imagine the you are correct about the intent and this is definitely a lawyering of the rules. Simply trying to point out a possible oversight so that it can be addressed properly.

[cgmv123]

I think the manual makes it pretty clear that the floor is Level 0. Thus, you have to be completely supported by Bar 1 to touch Bar 2 and have it be part of a legal climb.

[jvriezen]

It would be great if the GDC puts out an update that includes diagrams of 'robots' climbing and showing legal and illegal climbing intermediate positions-- especially in relation to the floor and/or leg floor plates. Also examples that involve touching the legs of the pyramid. Sort of like they do for Ok/Not Ok bumper configurations.

[yara92]

Originally Posted by Dinoyan

Climbing the PYRAMID is the big deal this year

"how" we're going to climb the PYRAMID?

The simple way is the best may be Pnaumatics

[Alan Anderson]

Originally Posted by cgmv123

I think the manual makes it pretty clear that the floor is Level 0.

It isn't quite so clear about the floor being part of the pyramid, though. This is one spot where I expect an update to the rules.

[cgmv123]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

It isn't quite so clear about the floor being part of the pyramid, though. This is one spot where I expect an update to the rules.

But for the purpose of climbing, the floor counts as a level. It doesn't matter whether or not it's part of the pyramid for the purposes of climbing.

A ROBOT has CLIMBED its PYRAMID if it contacts the PYRAMID and/or the floor (Level 0) in

A. sequential order (Level 0, 1, 2, 3) during ascent

[BigJ]

Originally Posted by cgmv123

But for the purpose of climbing, the floor counts as a level. It doesn't matter whether or not it's part of the pyramid for the purposes of climbing.

(to give Alan some credit, this was just clarified in the rules update today )

[Bob Steele]

Originally Posted by BigJ

(to give Alan some credit, this was just clarified in the rules update today )

Yes Alan successfully predicted the update!!!
:0)

Before the update it was not clear that floor contact made any difference in climbing.

[rich2202]

Well, the rule change clarified whether you can touch the floor and bar 2 at the same time - Not!

Another scenario:

The bar is at the top of a level. When you grab on the bar, part of your apparatus is above the bar, and in the higher level. Since it is not touching the pyramid above the bar, that is not a problem.

Issue:

What if you are grabbing at the corner? Or, if you want to grab the corner? Then, you will come into contact with a portion of the vertical pole that is above the horizontal bar.

Question:

Is there a portion of the vertical pole, immediately above the bar, that can considered part of the lower zone if another portion of the robot it touching the pyramid in the lower zone?

If you are below the bar, then you want to be able to grab the corner and climb up, and incidentally be contacting the pyramid in the higher zone. Similarly, you could be a fraction of an inch above the lower bar, be contacting the vertical bar a fraction of an inch above the corner, grabbing onto the next higher bar, and should be considered as touching the higher zone (not touching any other part of the pyramid in the lower zone).

It would be helpful to allow the 5 inches (or whatever nominal amount) of the vertical pole above a corner to be considered part of the lower zone if the robot is touching any other part of the pyramid in the lower zone. Or, for purposes of the 2 zone rule, the 5 inches of the vertical pole immediately above a corner is considered to be in whichever zone (actual zone, or immediately lower zone) that is most advantageous for the robot.

[Siri]

Originally Posted by rich2202

Well, the rule change clarified whether you can touch the floor and bar 2 at the same time - Not! ...

I'm not sure what you mean. The second bar is between Levels 2 and 3--certainly that's well out of the realm of "sequential" with zero regardless of what fraction of an inch they could ever allow in tolerance...