Climbing Mechanism Ideas

[Cal578]

Originally Posted by frank.pendzich

...I believe this contest is really a test of team’s abilities to work together to scale that structure. That may be the reason why an individual robot can’t make contact with more than two rungs at a time and can only skip the first rung. It seems that we’re being setup to work together and it’s that feature that may in fact be designed into the game as the desired outcome by the game’s designers.
...

Under what circumstances can a robot skip the first rung? I read the game manual 3.1.5.2 as requiring contact with the pyramid in each zone (to get the points of the higher zones). Maybe you meant a robot climbing up the corner, so it contacts the pyramid on the corner piece in zone 1?

[ToddF]

Here is a way two robots working together could score 40 points legally, relatively easily.

Robot A: Flat top 8" off the ground with a ramp.
Robot B: Vertical arm with hook on top, extendible to 83 inches (max height is 84 inches)

1) Both robots drive into pyramid.
2) Robot B drives on top of robot A.
3) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
4) Robot B extends arm 25 inches (25+8=33)
5) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 1 bar.
6) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
7) Robot B extends arm 55 inches (55+8=63)
8) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 2 bar.
9) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
10) Robot B extends arm 83 inches (83+8=91)
11) Robot A drives so robot A's arm hooks onto zone 3 bar.
12) Robot B retracts arm (or activates winch) and raises itself straight up into zone 3 for 30 points.

This sequence follows the rules for climbing the pyramid precisely, robot B contacting each level sequentially and never contacting more than two levels at once.

For even more scoring goodness, robot A then raises an arm, hooks the zone 1 bar and lifts off the floor for another 10 points.

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by Randomness

It also depends on how you interpret the climbing rules... but it is my belief that robots have successfully climbed if they get to level 3 height without touching any parts of the pyramid.

That seems to be in direct conflict with the rules.

[nuggetsyl]

Originally Posted by ToddF

Here is a way two robots working together could score 30 points legally, relatively easily.

Robot A: Flat top 8" off the ground with a ramp.
Robot B: Vertical arm with hook on top, extendible to 83 inches (max height is 84 inches)

1) Both robots drive into pyramid.
2) Robot B drives on top of robot A.
3) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
4) Robot B extends arm 25 inches (25+8=33)
5) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 1 bar.
6) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
7) Robot B extends arm 55 inches (55+8=63)
8) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 2 bar.
9) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
10) Robot B extends arm 83 inches (83+8=91)
11) Robot A drives so robot A's arm hooks onto zone 3 bar.
12) Robot B retracts arm (or activates winch) and raises itself straight up into zone 3 for 30 points.

This sequence follows the rules for climbing the pyramid precisely, robot B contacting each level sequentially and never contacting more than two levels at once.

Teams had a hard time feeding balls to great shooters last year so I feel safe in saying this is not going to happen.

[mrnoble]

I'm not committed yet to the idea that scoring and climbing are entirely separate in terms of legality. I think there is some ambiguity that will need to be clarified on Wednesday. One reason is the weirdness of the idea that you must touch the footing (level 0) of the pyramid before progressing to the first rung. 3.1.5.2 could be interpreted as equating the "pyramid" not with the metal bars but with the zones controlled by the bars.

The implications of zones rather than bars are:
1) it will be a lot more difficult to grab the bars if level 1 ends at the plane tangent to the top of bar 1; climbing the corners may be the only feasible method.
2) If a robot is fortunate enough to have reached level 2, it could drop a line to a waiting alliance member below, and carry that robot up enough to no longer be in level 0.

If bars rather than zones,
1) climbing the rungs becomes more feasible (though still difficult).
2) a robot at level 3 could lower a cable to a robot partner on the ground, and lift it up, so long as the lower robot reaches out and touches the pyramid at specific points.

[TRIron95]

Originally Posted by ToddF

Here is a way two robots working together could score 40 points legally, relatively easily.

Robot A: Flat top 8" off the ground with a ramp.
Robot B: Vertical arm with hook on top, extendible to 83 inches (max height is 84 inches)

1) Both robots drive into pyramid.
2) Robot B drives on top of robot A.
3) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
4) Robot B extends arm 25 inches (25+8=33)
5) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 1 bar.
6) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
7) Robot B extends arm 55 inches (55+8=63)
8) Robot A drives so robot B's arm taps zone 2 bar.
9) Robot A drives to center of pyramid.
10) Robot B extends arm 83 inches (83+8=91)
11) Robot A drives so robot A's arm hooks onto zone 3 bar.
12) Robot B retracts arm (or activates winch) and raises itself straight up into zone 3 for 30 points.

This sequence follows the rules for climbing the pyramid precisely, robot B contacting each level sequentially and never contacting more than two levels at once.

For even more scoring goodness, robot A then raises an arm, hooks the zone 1 bar and lifts off the floor for another 10 points.

Extending the arm over 54" seems to be in violation with the rule that says your robot must never extend outside a 54" diameter cylinder.

[lorem3k]

Originally Posted by TRIron95

Extending the arm over 54" seems to be in violation with the rule that says your robot must never extend outside a 54" diameter cylinder.

I believe he means to extend the arm 54" vertically, rather than horizontally.

[ToddF]

Originally Posted by TRIron95

Extending the arm over 54" seems to be in violation with the rule that says your robot must never extend outside a 54" diameter cylinder.

The max envelope is a cylinder 54" in diameter, 84 inches tall.

[engunneer]

For any teams that have a 3D printer, I just published a design that might help you think about climbing. I made the model for my desk at home so I can stare at it and imagine all the robots climbing up.

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:40727

[mrnoble]

Originally Posted by engunneer

For any teams that have a 3D printer, I just published a design that might help you think about climbing. I made the model for my desk at home so I can stare at it and imagine all the robots climbing up.

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:40727

That is super cool.

[engunneer]

Originally Posted by mrnoble

If bars rather than zones,
1) climbing the rungs becomes more feasible (though still difficult).
2) a robot at level 3 could lower a cable to a robot partner on the ground, and lift it up, so long as the lower robot reaches out and touches the pyramid at specific points.

I believe this is the interpretation that was intended. They would not have made the pyramid as it is without intending teams to climb the outer or inner 'faces' of the pyramid.

your second point about lifting a robot that touches each section in sequence (probably by being bounced off the horizontal bars along the way) seems like a legal corner case to me.

[ToddF]

Here's another cooperation idea.

The trickiest part of the climb is leaving zone 0 before touching the zone 2 bar. If you could sit on the floor and reach up to the zone 2 bar (touching zone 1 bar first, of course), inch worming up to the top isn't too hard.

So, robot A deploys a tarp from a roll and tows the tarp under the lowest bar, spreading it out to cover the ground. The tarp could be pretty big and not violate the 54" diameter rule. Robot B drives onto the tarp, thus leaving contact with zone 0, and inchworms up the pyramid, from bar to bar.

Robot A then reels in the tarp and hangs for ten points. Much less coordination between the two robots.

[Djur]

On the subject of coopertition...

A few kids on my team had the idea of a skyhook that would reach down and grab a friendly robot by attaching to the eyelets/connecting points that are meant for the belay system. Making a skyhook, though, will be tough.

[nathan_hui]

Originally Posted by Djur

On the subject of coopertition...

A few kids on my team had the idea of a skyhook that would reach down and grab a friendly robot by attaching to the eyelets/connecting points that are meant for the belay system. Making a skyhook, though, will be tough.

I thought skyhooks were in the same genre as snipe hunts. Odd that they would be useful for design ideas...

[SM987]

Just prop yourself up on an air cylinder "foot" on top of a frisbee, throw a batman hook to rung 2 (making sure to somehow touch rung 1 in the process) and hang for a quick 20, or climb for a slower 30.