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Unread 09-01-2013, 21:29
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Very New and Very Clueless!

Hello everyone!

This is my first year in FIRST and I'm looking forward to learning what its about this season

In my FRC team (of about 15 people) I am one of only two people interested in programming...and our head programmer is a rookie too. our veteran programmer graduated last year and failed to teach him anything about LabVIEW...so we're pretty clueless.

Our current head programmer has previous programming experience so we're not completely lost...but we're pretty close:/

While the head programmer is focusing on learning LabVIEW, I'm trying to teach myself C++ (I have had ZERO previous programming experience before day after the start of the season...). However, once I grasp C++ I will try to learn LabVIEW as well.
I'm pretty good at teaching myself things so I hope it won't be too hard!

I was wondering if anyone had any pointers about how to go about learning C++ and LabVIEW without any previous experience or anything that might help a beginning programmer

Thank you so much!!
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Unread 09-01-2013, 21:37
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

www.frcmastery.com
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Unread 09-01-2013, 21:40
ming08108 ming08108 is offline
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

I would suggest LABview, it seems easer. Take this with a grain of salt we are a rookie team too.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:01
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Line View Post
Thanks for the links!
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:03
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

2 members of a programming team learning different languages isn't a bad thing, per se. However, when you have 6 weeks to learn and apply, and one project... You might want to reconsider your strategy.

First, what languages does the other programmer already know? If one of them is C++ or Java, then use that one. If not, I would strongly suggest that both of you learn LABView for now. I took a semester of C++ in college... and I think I might have a chance of making a robot move if I'm lucky (or someone held a gun to my head).

LABView is easier, as I understand it. Go with it. Then learn C++ later, when you aren't working under as tight a deadline.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:09
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricH View Post
2 members of a programming team learning different languages isn't a bad thing, per se. However, when you have 6 weeks to learn and apply, and one project... You might want to reconsider your strategy.

First, what languages does the other programmer already know? If one of them is C++ or Java, then use that one. If not, I would strongly suggest that both of you learn LABView for now. I took a semester of C++ in college... and I think I might have a chance of making a robot move if I'm lucky (or someone held a gun to my head).

LABView is easier, as I understand it. Go with it. Then learn C++ later, when you aren't working under as tight a deadline.
He currently knows a little of Java but mostly C++ and wants to learn LabVIEW but that isn't going very well....he is considering switching to C++ but doesn't know it well enough to completely program the robot.

I took a look at LabVIEW this afternoon and it looks VERY simple. So I'm going to try and get that down this season.

But the reason I'm learning C++ is to learn how to program (and also because he knows it already)...because LabVIEW is pretty visual instead of using code.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:17
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Quote:
Originally Posted by thetimemachine View Post
While the head programmer is focusing on learning LabVIEW, I'm trying to teach myself C++ (I have had ZERO previous programming experience before day after the start of the season...). However, once I grasp C++ I will try to learn LabVIEW as well.
Well, the biggest problem is you need a ROBOT programmer, not a head programmer

Learning C++ is not trivial, and 6 weeks is cutting it close. But if HE knows some, and you learn some, you have a good shot. Labview is easier to master, but it still takes time. If both of you are starting from zero, maybe too much time.

There are a lot of C++ resources for FRC out there, check the links on the usfirst.org site and search CheifDelphi.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:18
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Haha, your going between mine and your posts, that made me laugh. i was wondering what is LabView. sorry for asking such a simple question, i am also new to programming.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:19
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Most of the same basic constructs you'd find in a text-based language are present in Labview, they're just more visual. I recommend learning one language at a time so you don't get confused by different terminology. Once you get the basics of programming down in one language, they transfer pretty well. For example, a Select block in Labview is the functional equivalent of an if/then/else statement in C. The only weird thing about Labview is using dataflow through the wires rather than passing variables around explicitly.

The frcmastery videos start pretty basic and work up. NI.com also has a lot of good resources for Labview.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonRotolo View Post
Well, the biggest problem is you need a ROBOT programmer, not a head programmer

Learning C++ is not trivial, and 6 weeks is cutting it close. But if HE knows some, and you learn some, you have a good shot. Labview is easier to master, but it still takes time. If both of you are starting from zero, maybe too much time.

There are a lot of C++ resources for FRC out there, check the links on the usfirst.org site and search CheifDelphi.
haha

We're just in a pretty tricky situation....

The good part is that we have a mentor who knows Labview and a few outside contacts as well...

We'll probably just stick with Labview unless we get really frustrated....the biggest problem is getting out camera to work right now

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNewCode View Post
Haha, your going between mine and your posts, that made me laugh. i was wondering what is LabView. sorry for asking such a simple question, i am also new to programming.
LabVIEW is one of the other programming languages (other than C++ or Java) that is most often used in FRC

haha its fine

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhcook View Post
Most of the same basic constructs you'd find in a text-based language are present in Labview, they're just more visual. I recommend learning one language at a time so you don't get confused by different terminology. Once you get the basics of programming down in one language, they transfer pretty well. For example, a Select block in Labview is the functional equivalent of an if/then/else statement in C. The only weird thing about Labview is using dataflow through the wires rather than passing variables around explicitly.

The frcmastery videos start pretty basic and work up. NI.com also has a lot of good resources for Labview.
Yeah the wire stuff is pretty confusing...

We just need some practice and "play" time

Last edited by artdutra04 : 10-01-2013 at 01:47. Reason: Merged three back-to-back posts together
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:28
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Sorry for posting this again, but i was wondering what LabView focus is in programming like visual or something as i am a new at programming, so please help with links and resources for either C++, Java, or LabView as i hear it is a simple language.
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:30
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNewCode View Post
Sorry for posting this again, but i was wondering what LabView focus is in programming like visual or something as i am a new at programming, so please help with links and resources for either C++, Java, or LabView as i hear it is a simple language.
I've been referred to www.frcmastery.com and it seems pretty helpful
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:32
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

Quote:
Originally Posted by thetimemachine View Post
I've been referred to www.frcmastery.com and it seems pretty helpful
Thank you, i guess. lol
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:36
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

This might help too

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr...ical-Resources
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Unread 09-01-2013, 22:54
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Re: Very New and Very Clueless!

In my opinion (perhaps a little biased because we use Java) a text based language is much easier to use. I tried helping another team with Labview at the last competition and had no idea what I was doing, but I got it to work in the end. If you or the person you work are familiar with C++, I would suggest going with that. There are some new resources to support that here: http://wpilib.screenstepslive.com/s/3120/m/7913

On the other hand, if you have a general knowledge of programming concepts, Labview is very easy to learn, and FIRST (with it's partnership with NI) seems to have a lot more support for using Labview than for using C++ or Java, i.e. the virtual cRIO which only has support for Labview.
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