Ultimate Ascent - Most Difficult Ever? Too difficult?

[Jay O'Donnell]

I agree that this challenge is one of the hardest yet, but isn't that the point of FIRST? If the objective is to train students for a realistic work experience, then this game is perfect. In the real world, problems don't always have easy answers and long deadlines, and you have to work past that.
In short, bravo FIRST, and thank you for a very difficult challenge.

[stingray27]

Originally Posted by ks_mumupsi

However, because of what i have said above the differentiating factor this year will be climbing or a 469 (2010) type strategy if someone figures out how to shoot the full court from sitting in their home zone and just unloading 45 discs in a minute or so. (which i also think we will see designs for this year, effectiveness is yet tbd)

I really hope to see another team (rookie or not) create a giant net that extends to the full 84 in mark so that they can stop teams like this. Guarantee in a regional where this strategy is prevalent and benefiting a team, the alliance that wins will have a robot just to do this...

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by stingray27

I really hope to see another team (rookie or not) create a giant net that extends to the full 84 in mark so that they can stop teams like this. Guarantee in a regional where this strategy is prevalent and benefiting a team, the alliance that wins will have a robot just to do this...

We're looking at the possibility of rigging our robot to do just that, just in case, if we have the weight...

[mikegrundvig]

Originally Posted by pfreivald

We're looking at the possibility of rigging our robot to do just that, just in case, if we have the weight...

Same

[mikemascot]

my team has been having some trouble with the climbing portions so where it was once a student/mentor project. Now it is a full mentor project that has taken the last week up

[Doug G]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

This is my 12th year in FIRST Robotics, and I'd thought the build had generally become somewhat routine, the games somewhat predicable, and I'd just about seen it all. But now in the third week of build season, I'm finding this very difficult. Even with the ability to rapidly make parts in-house and over a decade of experience of doing this, I'm finding myself doubting our abilities to get it all done by the deadline, and do everything well in this game, and keep the robot built to our standards of quality.
....
I'm not saying I want an easier challenge, but if after 12 years and almost all the resources we could need, me finding it difficult makes me think it's terrifying if not impossible for many teams to do well in this year's game.

Anyone agree with any of the above?

I absolutely agree with you Dave... I read your post and feel so much in the same boat as you, it actually made me feel a bit better. I've been at this for 13 years, have a good amount of resources... and don't feel we will make our benchmarks for this year... Each year we seem to do a bit better with building the bot plan, but it has been a real switch up this year. It is a good thing, but seriously, 112 perimeter is just so limiting. We will get something together, but the dream of being better that the 3 day bot, is sadly fading. I'm glad they did the 3daybot, but now we all compare our bots to it. If you can't make it better than that, why not just build that bot?

Originally Posted by mikemascot

my team has been having some trouble with the climbing portions so where it was once a student/mentor project. Now it is a full mentor project that has taken the last week up

And there in lies a problem we have on our team... we have a few mentor resources, but not enough to get through these problems with design. So ultimately we are having to forgo either floor pickup, 20 pt hang, or both.

[Mr. Van]

Dave, Doug and others -

Thanks for making us all feel a little bit better and a little less alone.

This game would have been challenging without the 112 in. and 54 in. limits.

It's made my brain hurt.

- Mr. Van
Coach, Robodox

[waialua359]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

As a teacher, on top of my full time job, I've put in over 45 hours per week over each of the last two weeks (and so have some students) outside of the school day, and we're still behind. Being a real leader in this sport is a full time job, which is a lot on top of an already full time job.



Anyone agree with any of the above?

Join the club David.
Some of our students in our program average over 300+ hours outside of school during build season. This isnt an exaggeration, and we had some crazy ones put in 400 in the past.
The problem with that is an adult is here also.
Adding the whole money issue for us and having families (I'm a daddy and husband), makes it even more so.

There are pressures to not tone it down, let some things go, and outright doing less.

Donors give more when you do more, which indirectly affects your success as we all focus on robot building and student learning experiences.

[Tom Line]

Originally Posted by stingray27

I really hope to see another team (rookie or not) create a giant net that extends to the full 84 in mark so that they can stop teams like this. Guarantee in a regional where this strategy is prevalent and benefiting a team, the alliance that wins will have a robot just to do this...

Hmmm. I'm sure someone will do that...

[Tom Line]

Originally Posted by waialua359

Join the club David.
Some of our students in our program average over 300+ hours outside of school during build season. This isnt an exaggeration, and we had some crazy ones put in 400 in the past.
The problem with that is an adult is here also.
Adding the whole money issue for us and having families (I'm a daddy and husband), makes it even more so.

There are pressures to not tone it down, let some things go, and outright doing less.

Donors give more when you do more, which indirectly affects your success as we all focus on robot building and student learning experiences.

The number of people who mentor our team has exploded over the last 4 years. I directly attribute our team competitiveness to gaining some incredibly talented mentors in just about every field, from business to spirit.

Even with that many mentors, none of us have time to get everything done. My 3 kids now ask me if I'm going to work, or to robotics. They both consume equal amounts of time right now.

[Blackphantom91]

This is my 5th year apart of F.I.R.S.T 4th as a mentor and I would say this game is hard to an extent. Ultimate Accent has mechanics designed into the game that no one in first has ever seen or can look at other examples in previous games. The last two games most teams could accomplish everything. For example 2012 Bridge balancing could be done if you had just a capable drive-train. The end game currently requires a lot of thought and F.I.R.S.T is now making you make trade offs or think of the game in an entirely different way than the usual. As far as resources and time spent it is pretty heavy this season the question is how many teams can rise to the occasion and figure out how to play this game effectively to the fullest. I know my team is working though the weeks and are learning all the time. I think this is what FRC is about and is why I am still apart of it.

[JM033]

Yes this year is definitely hard. Right now, week 3 and we don't even have some key components settled out. We figured that 30 points might sound like a good thing to do, but there are too many variables that play a huge factor. What if the robot falls off? How much space are we willing to exchange for a climbing mechanism? We realize that the top scorers will have a successful 3rd level climb; if an alliance with three teams were do the same, they will be almost invincible. Also by reading throughout cd, many teams don't seem like they are picking off the ground, just feeder. Our goal is to make a great bot, with a fast, simple intake mechanism from the floor, and a precise shooter. But so far some stuff is looking really dismal atm.

[enrique]

I quit

[sanddrag]

Originally Posted by enrique

I quit

Lucky. My students won't let me.

Just kidding. But man..... I know we can do this, but this season is just going to be one for the books. This is a game where to do it really well, you do FIRST and nothing else. It consumes you. The reward will be when this thing all comes together and works. The difficulty in design for this is a big step up for us. I like it, but it's scary.

[dellagd]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

The difficulty in design for this is a big step up for us. I like it, but it's scary.

Couldn't agree more. Goes back to one of FIRST's mottos: "Its the hardest fun you'll ever have"

This season is different from last year. Maybe its because its my 2nd year now and I know how things go, but I definitely have a lot more stress than I did last year. I feel like this game is a lot less definite. The season more unknown. Last year, you could pretty well predict how well you were going to do. We could tip the bridge very well and shoot ok, so I figured we'd have an ok year, and we did. This year, Im seeing a lot less teams that build these all-in-one bots that are very successful at every area of the game. Sure, they'll be there, but not like in previous years. And because the aim of the season is no longer to do everything well, how do I exactly qualify at what point of functionality our robot will be successful?

If we go for the 30 points, I could see that making us a pretty good team, giving a guaranteed 30 points + some more every time. Or we could show up and everyone can get to the third level, and all of a sudden we're just a average bot that gets 30 points in a gave where 60+ points is the norm.

Its just a different gameplay, and I cant decide if is more or less fun than before