At what point does it become unacceptable for a mentor to design/build the robot

[Ian Curtis]

Originally Posted by Taylor

Does anybody truly believe there are teams out there where the students "just watch the mentors"?
That just seems like a huge false dichotomy that's been used as the crux of a lot of arguments.

Yes, although exceedingly rare based on the people I've talked to that were on one. I would be willing to be there are a much larger proportion of teams where students feel disenfranchised by the amount of work done by mentors, and an even larger proportion of teams that get accused of being "just watch the mentors" when they are in fact a happy partnership. The first step is always to talk to them as if students are off gossiping in the corner most of the mentors I know are content to continue working without you -- but we'd like it even more if you'd help us! Plenty of adults would love to teach you, but are hesitant to tell kids to get back to work that they did not raise.

When 1276 won BAE in 2006 (my then HS team), we got accused of being mentor built on CD (I can't find the thread, it was an implication but clearly us)! I can assure you that we were in fact a happy 50/50 partnership, and as I begin the journey into being a mentor I find myself eternally grateful to my Dad, Keith, Joe, Phil, and others that volunteered their valuable time to teach me things I didn't even know I was learning until I have had to apply them later.

It is my opinion that teams should refer to their robot as "our" robot. It is not the "kid's" robot, and it is not the "mentor's" robot, it is "our" robot. Successful FRC teams build partnerships and people that many companies would pay good money for. Working at a big company I've taken classes and listen to plenty of talks about leadership, and have friends taking MBA classes. IFI and AM have figured this out...

I think a lot of companies give FIRST/FIRST teams money for not-quite-the-right reason. They consider it training for their future workforce, but they miss out on all the off-hours lessons their current employees could benefit from. I am 100% certain I would not be where I am today with FIRST.