What we learned from week 1

Originally Posted by TheMadCADer

A 7-disc autonomous is a killer this year, because it can be made much more reliable than a bridge autonomous could last year. 24 extra points right off the bat gets you a huge lead. The other alliance has to score 8 more discs than you just to catch up, and chances are your robot is also good at shooting tele-op discs if it can do a 7-disc auto.

A 7 disc auto would give you 42 points, no? Even more emphasizing your point on the importance of gaining a lead in autonomous. Your opponent would need to score 14 frisbees in the top goal to catch up.

[TheMadCADer]

Originally Posted by Andrew Lawrence

A 7 disc auto would give you 42 points, no? Even more emphasizing your point on the importance of gaining a lead in autonomous. Your opponent would need to score 14 frisbees in the top goal to catch up.

I should have pointed out that I was assuming the other robot that yours "matches-up" against has a pre-loaded 3-disc autonomous, so it would be 42-18 before other robots factor in (giving you that 24 point lead). Your point is absolutely valid if the other robot scores zero.

[Hebrew]

Any videos out of eliminations yet? I checked BA and could find nothing.

[Nathan Streeter]

Originally Posted by Hebrew

Any videos out of eliminations yet? I checked BA and could find nothing.

1519 has uploaded videos of 8 of the 9 quarter-finals at the Granite State Regional. Here's the playlist... http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLLJ8AkRj4AlXS0TSTsI5BrWEbRxhDpuK3&f eature=view_all... I believe we have more yet to upload.

I'm sure more videos from this and other regionals will also appear soon...

[sircedric4]

I learned a lot this weekend and all of it just makes me sick to my stomach. Looks like this year will be a very good year for lessons learned for our team bible.

1) The GDC did an awesome job this year building a trap. Let's call the game Ultimate Ascent and introduce this awesome pyramid and impossible top target and then it turns out to be a waste of a season to defeat the obstacle. We and only a few others conquered the very difficult only to watch EVERYONE (hyperbole!) outscore our top end.

We have this awesome climber and dumper and I am seriously thinking about scrapping the whole thing and bolting a quick 3 day robot shooter, human fed device and quick ram the bar 10 pointer to the robot at our one and only regional.

2) Autonomous and frisbee throwing is perhaps the easiest I have ever seen it when it comes to scoring pieces. This is a year that experience actually worked against us. There has never been a scoring game with such consistent pieces, so one lesson learned is always build a game piece scorer immediately before even trying to determine your strategy.


Congratulations all teams of FRC for bringing some good scoring to the game and I guess it will only get better from here for you frisbee throwers.

I could go on but I am just gonna try and reconcile what I saw this weekend with how we saw the games going and determine what we are gonna do. Honestly we are so tired after such an exhausting build season, that I suspect we will just "run what we brung" and we will be the cool looking climber that does contribute consistently. I know that will earn us a spot on an alliance, but it really is disappointing to take the road less traveled and find everyone else at the destination when you get there.

The journey this year will hopefully be worth it since we will definitely have a lot of lessons learned. This year the students and I get to deal with conquering the impossible and that awesome feeling, and then we get to learn how to deal with disappointment when everyone and their mother outscores with "easier" robots.


(PS. I am not trivializing the "easier" robots before you get all in a hissy, I know all those were built in the same 6 week vacuum we were. But shooters have been done for years and there was a 3 day robot, so frisbee throwers were easier to get a base scorer.) :-)

[swwrobotics]

Watching the Palmetto webcast, many teams got stuck at the feeder stations by not taking the time to line up right and unfortunately ended up with a bunch of frisbees blocking their way to the wall.

[dtengineering]

Originally Posted by sircedric4

I learned a lot this weekend and all of it just makes me sick to my stomach. Looks like this year will be a very good year for lessons learned for our team bible.

1) The GDC did an awesome job this year building a trap. Let's call the game Ultimate Ascent and introduce this awesome pyramid and impossible top target and then it turns out to be a waste of a season to defeat the obstacle. We and only a few others conquered the very difficult only to watch EVERYONE (hyperbole!) outscore our top end.

We have this awesome climber and dumper and I am seriously thinking ...

(PS. I am not trivializing the "easier" robots before you get all in a hissy, I know all those were built in the same 6 week vacuum we were. But shooters have been done for years and there was a 3 day robot, so frisbee throwers were easier to get a base scorer.) :-)

The GDC is not responsible for your team's analysis of the game.

Jason

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by sircedric4

I learned a lot this weekend and all of it just makes me sick to my stomach. Looks like this year will be a very good year for lessons learned for our team bible.

1) The GDC did an awesome job this year building a trap. Let's call the game Ultimate Ascent and introduce this awesome pyramid and impossible top target and then it turns out to be a waste of a season to defeat the obstacle. We and only a few others conquered the very difficult only to watch EVERYONE (hyperbole!) outscore our top end.

We have this awesome climber and dumper and I am seriously thinking about scrapping the whole thing and bolting a quick 3 day robot shooter, human fed device and quick ram the bar 10 pointer to the robot at our one and only regional.

I think you're underestimating what a 50 point climber (climb + dump) can accomplish with a team who is a top notch shooter.

Yes these climbers and dumpers can be beaten with two solid shooters, but it all depends on the full alliance.

[EricDrost]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

I think you're underestimating what a 50 point climber (climb + dump) can accomplish with a team who is a top notch shooter.

Yes these climbers and dumpers can be beaten with two solid shooters, but it all depends on the full alliance.

I'd rather have two good shooters than a climber and a shooter. Climbers often lack autonomous and top out at around 50 points. That's easily outscored by a robot that does autonomous and hangs for 10. It only requires two loads of discs, a number that's easily achievable.

Also, climbers (from what I've seen) tend to be less reliable.

[Alexa Stott]

Originally Posted by sircedric4

I learned a lot this weekend and all of it just makes me sick to my stomach. Looks like this year will be a very good year for lessons learned for our team bible.

1) The GDC did an awesome job this year building a trap. Let's call the game Ultimate Ascent and introduce this awesome pyramid and impossible top target and then it turns out to be a waste of a season to defeat the obstacle. We and only a few others conquered the very difficult only to watch EVERYONE (hyperbole!) outscore our top end.

We have this awesome climber and dumper and I am seriously thinking about scrapping the whole thing and bolting a quick 3 day robot shooter, human fed device and quick ram the bar 10 pointer to the robot at our one and only regional.

2) Autonomous and frisbee throwing is perhaps the easiest I have ever seen it when it comes to scoring pieces. This is a year that experience actually worked against us. There has never been a scoring game with such consistent pieces, so one lesson learned is always build a game piece scorer immediately before even trying to determine your strategy.


Congratulations all teams of FRC for bringing some good scoring to the game and I guess it will only get better from here for you frisbee throwers.

I could go on but I am just gonna try and reconcile what I saw this weekend with how we saw the games going and determine what we are gonna do. Honestly we are so tired after such an exhausting build season, that I suspect we will just "run what we brung" and we will be the cool looking climber that does contribute consistently. I know that will earn us a spot on an alliance, but it really is disappointing to take the road less traveled and find everyone else at the destination when you get there.

The journey this year will hopefully be worth it since we will definitely have a lot of lessons learned. This year the students and I get to deal with conquering the impossible and that awesome feeling, and then we get to learn how to deal with disappointment when everyone and their mother outscores with "easier" robots.


(PS. I am not trivializing the "easier" robots before you get all in a hissy, I know all those were built in the same 6 week vacuum we were. But shooters have been done for years and there was a 3 day robot, so frisbee throwers were easier to get a base scorer.) :-)

Sorry, but the smiley face at the end of your post doesn't make it any less offensive to all the teams that worked their butt off (same as you) to build their effective frisbee shooters and 10 point climbers.

[sircedric4]

Originally Posted by Alexa Stott

Sorry, but the smiley face at the end of your post doesn't make it any less offensive to all the teams that worked their butt off (same as you) to build their effective frisbee shooters and 10 point climbers.

The quotes, the smiley face, and the explanation after the PS is there to ensure that no offense was given. This is the internet and even if you go to lengths to try and show that your statements are your own opinion and are not disparaging there is still a possibility of miscommunication.

I apologize to all those that took my remarks as disparaging when they were not meant that way. So another lesson learned from this thread. :-)

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

I think you're underestimating what a 50 point climber (climb + dump) can accomplish with a team who is a top notch shooter.

Yes these climbers and dumpers can be beaten with two solid shooters, but it all depends on the full alliance.

Actually I am feeling a lot better today than when I made my previous remarks, I was reading the average scores posted earlier as being per robot instead of per alliance. I do think we will find a place to fit in with our climber / dumper after all. And regardless we will have a cool looking robot and a lot of lessons learned to go forward with. Another lesson is don't post on Chief Delphi disappointed, stop and evaluate first. Emotions suck sometimes. :-)

[MisterG]

Originally Posted by sircedric4

Actually I am feeling a lot better today than when I made my previous remarks, I was reading the average scores posted earlier as being per robot instead of per alliance. I do think we will find a place to fit in with our climber / dumper after all. And regardless we will have a cool looking robot and a lot of lessons learned to go forward with. Another lesson is don't post on Chief Delphi disappointed, stop and evaluate first. Emotions suck sometimes. :-)

Darren,

I was really happy to see you post this follow up. We have all had the feeling that we brought a knife to a gunfight. On the other hand if you can do even one aspect of the game consistently you will stand out during scouting and have a decent chance of being picked.

-al g

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by sircedric4

I learned a lot this weekend and all of it just makes me sick to my stomach. Looks like this year will be a very good year for lessons learned for our team bible.

1) The GDC did an awesome job this year building a trap. Let's call the game Ultimate Ascent and introduce this awesome pyramid and impossible top target and then it turns out to be a waste of a season to defeat the obstacle. We and only a few others conquered the very difficult only to watch EVERYONE (hyperbole!) outscore our top end.

I hope the lesson is to properly evaluate all the scoring options.

[Akash Rastogi]

Observation/learned - many teams still don't have reliable, or any in some instances, 10 point hangers.