What did we learn from week 2 of the 2013 season?

[ThomasClark]

Originally Posted by dcarr

Wow, that's a very nice chart.

I'm not seeing how to read this directly - what are, say, 50th, 75th, and 90th percentiles in terms of overall scores?

Thanks.

The 75th and 90th percentiles are 70 points and 95 points, which are written on the right. I didn't include the median, but it was 46 points.

[dcarr]

Originally Posted by ThomasClark

Thanks.

The 75th and 90th percentiles are 70 points and 95 points, which are written on the right. I didn't include the median, but it was 46 points.

Oh okay, thanks.

[Gregor]

Very interesting chart.

The highest scored was actually 211, not 204, scored by the alliance of 2056, 1114, and 1325 in SF 1-2.

The score published right away was lower, but after the manual count it was updated to 211.

[mashygpig]

You shouldn't rely on climb and dump teams, we picked one as the #1 seed at Superior and they never even climbed. A good strategy can score you lots of points even with bad robots. defense really comes to play in finals.

[MattC9]

Originally Posted by mashygpig

You shouldn't rely on climb and dump teams, we picked one as the #1 seed at Superior and they never even climbed. A good strategy can score you lots of points even with bad robots. defense really comes to play in finals.

Can you please explain?

[ttldomination]

Originally Posted by mashygpig

You shouldn't rely on climb and dump teams, we picked one as the #1 seed at Superior and they never even climbed. A good strategy can score you lots of points even with bad robots. defense really comes to play in finals.

While I'm inclined to agree, I think this is a gross generalization.

I'd take a consistent climb and dump team over an inconsistent shooter any day (e.g 4451). The key is consistency and making sure that they know that it's up to them to get their 50 points.

- Sunny g.

[Bryan Herbst]

Originally Posted by mashygpig

You shouldn't rely on climb and dump teams, we picked one as the #1 seed at Superior and they never even climbed. A good strategy can score you lots of points even with bad robots. defense really comes to play in finals.

For those who weren't at Lake Superior: 2220 (#1 seed) picked 2177 as their first alliance partner. 2177 was a stellar team that was able to consistently climb to the top of the pyramid and score 3-4 frisbees by the end of qualifications.

Unfortunately, the #8 seed proved a very challenging defense to overcome. 2177 couldn't get to the feeding station to load up on colored frisbees, and in my opinion spent a little too much time trying to get those frisbees (kudos for coming up with a strategy and sticking to it though).

So what I learned in week 2 is that it isn't too difficult to block the feeding station. In general, defense is playing a far larger role in this game than I thought it would. No offensive strategy is without an opposing defensive strategy.

[Kellen Hill]

Originally Posted by Tanis

For those who weren't at Lake Superior: 2220 (#1 seed) picked 2177 as their first alliance partner. 2177 was a stellar team that was able to consistently climb to the top of the pyramid and score 3-4 frisbees by the end of qualifications.

Unfortunately, the #8 seed proved a very challenging defense to overcome. 2177 couldn't get to the feeding station to load up on colored frisbees, and in my opinion spent a little too much time trying to get those frisbees (kudos for coming up with a strategy and sticking to it though).

So what I learned in week 2 is that it isn't too difficult to block the feeding station. In general, defense is playing a far larger role in this game than I thought it would. No offensive strategy is without an opposing defensive strategy.

I can think of a 48 point strategy that is indefensible.

I'm wondering why some teams think it's easier to be a 50 point climber/dumper instead of a 48 point auton/climb. Why cross the field when you can stay protected under the pyramid the whole match (as long as team 48 isn't at your regional)?

Who knows, maybe those two extra points are worth it...

[Alpha Beta]

Originally Posted by Kellen Hill

I can think of a 48 point strategy that is indefensible.

I'm wondering why some teams think it's easier to be a 50 point climber/dumper instead of a 48 point auton/climb. Why cross the field when you can stay protected under the pyramid the whole match (as long as team 48 isn't at your regional)?

Who knows, maybe those two extra points are worth it...

I can think of an indefensible 72 point strategy. Don't think we'll be skipping the teleop phase to carry it out though.

[Kellen Hill]

Originally Posted by Alpha Beta

I can think of an indefensible 72 point strategy. Don't think we'll be skipping the teleop phase to carry it out though.

I'm sure your opponents would prefer it if you did

Good luck at KC this weekend!

[sdcantrell56]

Originally Posted by Kellen Hill

I can think of a 48 point strategy that is indefensible.

I'm wondering why some teams think it's easier to be a 50 point climber/dumper instead of a 48 point auton/climb. Why cross the field when you can stay protected under the pyramid the whole match (as long as team 48 isn't at your regional)?

Who knows, maybe those two extra points are worth it...

Sounds like you being down in georgia is going to make competition a bit more interesting now. We designed around this exact scenario.

[NXTGeek]

Originally Posted by Kellen Hill

I'm wondering why some teams think it's easier to be a 50 point climber/dumper instead of a 48 point auton/climb. Why cross the field when you can stay protected under the pyramid the whole match (as long as team 48 isn't at your regional)?

Who knows, maybe those two extra points are worth it...

THIS.

[ThomasClark]

Originally Posted by Gregor

Very interesting chart.

The highest scored was actually 211, not 204, scored by the alliance of 2056, 1114, and 1325 in SF 1-2.

The score published right away was lower, but after the manual count it was updated to 211.

I know, but FRC Spy sometimes has out of date scores in cases like that.

[Gregor]

Originally Posted by ThomasClark

I know, but FRC Spy sometimes has out of date scores in cases like that.

Not trying to discredit your data collection or anything, its just me being nitpicky (only because I'm the one who had to count the frisbees).

[Alex.q]

My former team learned the hard way about the importance of sticking to scouting data rather than gut feelings. The scout leads collected data throughout the tournament at Lake Superior and came up with a strong list of candidates to pick from. Certain members of the team, however, decided that they would rather pick another robot based on more showy abilities, which the data suggested were not as consistent as other potential picks. Ignoring the scouting and strategy advised by the lead scouts, they decided to pick robots which the scouts did not advise. I would love to say that it worked out for them, but that was not the case. Their #1 alliance ended up being outscored and upset by the 8th seed alliance.

The important lesson I hope was learned is to trust your teammates who put a lot of effort and research into their tasks. (Broadening this lesson), it is easy to become sure that your judgment or design is the best way for the team to proceed, but to become so attached to your design or ideas of who to select in eliminations that you ignore the research and data that is presented is a dangerous situation to find yourself in.


Disclaimer: I heard only one side of this story, and I do not mean to offend anyone or call anyone out. I just want to point out a learning experience that can be frustrating but essential. We all become attached to our ideas, and it is important to disassociate yourself from that idea to logically evaluate the situation, and to listen with an open mind to those who have researched the topic.