Wild Card 2013

[itsjustmrb]

I was not asking about us getting a slot, although I would definitely take it, I just don't think the 1st loser should be looked over because they played in an early (or local) regional. I have only been involved in FIRST for a couple of years, but there are a couple of things that I don't think are in the interest of fair play. I guess my thought processes, being a teacher, are more about fairness and equality.

[Siri]

Originally Posted by itsjustmrb

I was not asking about us getting a slot, although I would definitely take it, I just don't think the 1st loser should be looked over because they played in an early (or local) regional. I have only been involved in FIRST for a couple of years, but there are a couple of things that I don't think are in the interest of fair play. I guess my thought processes, being a teacher, are more about fairness and equality.

I suspect the problem was that if they opened it to everyone, they'd just plain have too many qualifiers. The line had to be drawn somewhere, so they chose there. Perhaps if you found a different way to make the same cut that was more fair to earlier competitors (without being unfair to someone else...), FIRST would consider it.

[Mr. Lim]

Originally Posted by Alpha Beta

This seems like one more reason for teams to avoid week 1 regionals.

...and this is probably my only issue with the WildCard system in its current form.

When a team asks you "so, with this wildcard system... if I want the best shot at going to CMP, I should avoid GTRE, right?"

*shrug*

GTRE is an amazing event, and it shouldn't be disadvantaged in any way because of the qualification system or what week it falls on. The WildCard system is a BIG improvement, but there are still some imperfections. Hopefully we'll find a way to continue to improve moving forward.

It is a pretty tough pill to swallow knowing that making the finals as captain or 1st pick at GTRE gets you nothing, but doing the same at WAT or GTRW probably gets you a ticket to CMP. 4343 was the GTRE finalist alliance captain, and even snagged a #17 in the world ranking on FRCTop25.com in week 2. Had they achieved the same feat at GTRW instead of GTRE, they'd (likely) be going to champs.

Instead, they're going to need to do it all over again in a few weeks to earn a spot at CMP...

Putting myself in 4343's shoes, I think I'd find that frustrating.

A lot of these concerns were brought up and hashed out in this thread, which was created when the WildCards were first announced:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=108344

A lot of good analysis and opinions there...

[Gregor]

Originally Posted by Mr. Lim

Instead, they're going to need to do it all over again in a few weeks to earn a spot at CMP...

It's actually worse than that. As of right now, they are not signed up for any more events.

[Racer26]

Originally Posted by Mr. Lim

4343 was the GTRE finalist alliance captain, and even snagged a #17 in the world ranking on FRCTop25.com in week 2. Had they achieved the same feat at GTRW instead of GTRE, they'd (likely) be going to champs.

Instead, they're going to need to do it all over again in a few weeks to earn a spot at CMP...

Putting myself in 4343's shoes, I think I'd find that frustrating.

Yup, it's certainly frustrating, especially when you consider that 1114 and 2056 were both pre-qualified as 2012 Einstein bots, and 1114 as a HOF bot, and in addition, our alliance partner in 1241 earned a seat by winning EI.

We'd need to do it again in the coming weeks, if we can even find the money and get approval to compete at another 2013 regional. As a Catholic school, GTRWest falling on Easter weekend makes that a hard option to sell with the school/board, and Waterloo is at capacity, leaving something more distant like Midwest or Western Canada as the remaining options, which carries more cost.

Another thought I just had though: Had the 4343/1241/216 alliance won, would 1325 have still gotten a seat because of 1241's double qualification and 1114/2056 being prequalified? I think the answer is no.

[Racer26]

Good news!

4343 will be competing at GTR West. The students found some additional sponsors over the March Break, and made a presentation to the Principal and Superintendent (without mentor input, beyond "You need to talk to them and get approval.") and got the go ahead!

The students put together an excellent presentation about both robot performance, and how competing would not interfere with most of the liturgical celebrations for Easter, and the one that it does interfere with is excusable because we aren't forcing anyone to go.

We're also hoping to use that withholding allowance to make some improvements, to stop that top frisbee falling out, and there might be another trick or two up our sleeves if we have time.

[Gregor]

After winning GTRE and Waterloo, 1114 and 2056 generated 2 wildcards for 1310 and 3756. 610 won BAE in week 1 so the wildcard skipped over them.

All 6 teams in the finals at Waterloo have qualified for championships.

[Thad House]

It was actually guaranteed that all 6 robots in the finals at waterloo would make it to worlds. Because if #2 won, 610 would generate a wild card, and that would have gone to 4069.

[Gregor]

Originally Posted by sst.thad

It was actually guaranteed that all 6 robots in the finals at waterloo would make it to worlds. Because if #2 won, 610 would generate a wild card, and that would have gone to 4069.

Yep. 1310, 3756, and 4069 were all cheering after they won their respective semis.

After years of good but not good enough robots, 1310 finally qualified for championships. They are the reason the wildcards exists.

[PVCpirate]

Originally Posted by Gregor

After winning GTRE and Waterloo, 1114 and 2056 generated 2 wildcards for 1310 and 3756. 610 won BAE in week 1 so the wildcard skipped over them.

All 6 teams in the finals at Waterloo have qualified for championships.

Congratulations are also in order for teams 155, 3802, and 1569 for qualifying as finalist alliance captains at their events:

155: Bayou, slot opened by 118
3802: Dallas, slot opened by 148
1569: Utah, slot opened by 359

Wisconsin now holds the lead for most wildcard eligible teams without opening a slot(4). I'm sure we'll see that number go up soon.

[Nuttyman54]

SVR is going to be Wildcard heaven. I now count 7 teams bringing wildcard possibilities with them:

118 - Win (Lone Star, Bayou)
148 - Win (Lone Star, Dallas)
192 - Win (Utah)
254 - Win (San Diego)
846 - EI (Boston)
973 - Win (Los Angeles)
1868 - RCA (Sacramento)
4543 - RAS (Central Valley)

[Gregor]

Originally Posted by Nuttyman54

SVR is going to be Wildcard heaven. I now count 7 teams bringing wildcard possibilities with them:

118 - Win (Lone Star, Bayou)
148 - Win (Lone Star, Dallas)
192 - Win (Utah)
254 - Win (San Diego)
846 - EI (Boston)
973 - Win (Los Angeles)
1868 - RCA (Sacramento)
4543 - RAS (Central Valley)

As will GTRW, I count 10 possible wildcard generating teams.

Originally Posted by Gregor

The following teams can open up wildcards at GTR West, should they win:

1075-Montreal Regional winners
1114-GTR East, Waterloo winners
1241-GTR East Engineering Inspiration Award winners
1305-Waterloo Chairmans Award winners
1310-Waterloo Wildcard
1325-GTR East winners
1503-Pittsburg winners
2056-GTR East, Waterloo winners, Waterloo Engineering Inspiration Award winners
3756-Waterloo wildcard
4069-Waterloo winners

This should be interesting.

[Ultimatum]

Originally Posted by Nuttyman54

SVR is going to be Wildcard heaven. I now count 7 teams bringing wildcard possibilities with them:

118 - Win (Lone Star, Bayou)
148 - Win (Lone Star, Dallas)
192 - Win (Utah)
254 - Win (San Diego)
846 - EI (Boston)
973 - Win (Los Angeles)
1868 - RCA (Sacramento)
4543 - RAS (Central Valley)

Actually, SVR is better than 7. There are 9 teams that will be opening them up so far.

118, 148, 192, 254, 295, 840, 973, 2489, 4543 are all wildcard possibilities. (you missed the Central Valley regional winners).

[Basel A]

I attached a file that includes all teams that have qualified for the Championship during this season (and therefore all teams that can open wild card spots in their later events). It also shows those teams' Week 5 events. Finally, how each team qualified, in a separate worksheet.

5 wild card spots were opened in Week 4. Congratulations to 155 at the Bayou Regional, 3802 at the Dallas Regional, 1569 at the Utah Regional, and 1310 and 3756 at the Waterloo Regional. Their spots were opened by 118, 148, 359, and 2056 and 1114, respectively.

There have been 16 extra qualifications and 6 wild card spots generated. The following teams are listed with (# of qualifications, # of wild card spots opened):
118 (3, 1)
2056 (3, 1)
126 (2, 0)
128 (2, 0)
148 (2, 1)
359 (2, 1)
701 (2, 0)
1114 (2, 1)
1208 (2, 0)
1732 (2, 0)
1986 (2, 1)
2046 (2, 0)
3990 (2, 0)
4451 (2, 0)

There's a number of teams that could open wild card slots in Week 5. I'll list them here:
Alamo: 1429, 2468, & 2789
Buckeye: 781, 1747, & 3003
Connecticut: 694 & 2168
Inland Empire: 1138, 1323, 1538, 1622, 2486, & 3880
10000 Lakes: 525 & 2052
Oklahoma: 932, 1540, 1806, 1986, & 3931
Seattle: 1983, 2910, & 3574
Smoky Mountains: 3797
South Florida: 744
Toronto West: 1075, 1114, 1241, 1305, 1310, 1325, 1503, 2056, 3756, & 4069
Washington DC: 79, 379, 467, 836, 2415, & 2974


If any of these teams are Regional Champions at their respective competitions, they will open a wild card spot for a team from the Finalist Alliance.

[Gregor]

4069 won Waterloo, and will be attending GTRW next week. They can also generate a wildcard.