Make your Champs predictions!

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by DevenStonow

But also keep in mind there were no FCS's in MAR Champs finals (2729 don't count as they were a cycler 99% of the time), and each alliance had one ground pickup.

Especially given auto, I think it's a given that no alliance on Einstein will be strictly cyclers.

You don't need 3 robots to get all of the points in auto. How would an alliance with 118, 1114, and a strict cycler that can cover whatever discs they don't score be better if it was an FCS instead? 1114 covers the 12 point bonus the opponent would get in a perfect auto by the 50 point play the other 30pt climbers can't make.

[Steven Donow]

Originally Posted by PayneTrain

You don't need 3 robots to get all of the points in auto. How would an alliance with 118, 1114, and a strict cycler that can cover whatever discs they don't score be better if it was an FCS instead? 1114 covers the 12 point bonus the opponent would get in a perfect auto by the 50 point play the other 30pt climbers can't make.

My comment about FCS was strictly in response to what the quoted user was saying about MAR Champs where a 50 point play was never in play during the finals

[Samwaldo]

All this talk really shows what this game has developed into: A shooting game with 10 point hangs.

Very few robots mentioned here climb for 20 or 30. The few include 1114, 67, etc.

kinda upset about that because some of the most memorable matches are with those that are determined by if a robot can climb to 30 (and sometimes dump). To this day i will always remember being in Boston during the finals. I have never heard so much people screaming in excitement and anticipation for the outcome of a match. Team 88's climb and dump was the most exciting thing to ever hit Boston! With out a doubt. Now imagine a 30 point climb on Einstein, MAYBE even with a fall.

[Link07]

Originally Posted by Samwaldo

Now imagine a 30 point climb on Einstein, MAYBE even with a fall.

I imagine there WILL be at least one thirty climber on Einstein, but one who can do it fast and offers much more than just the climb (ie 254)

[PayneTrain]

Originally Posted by DevenStonow

My comment about FCS was strictly in response to what the quoted user was saying about MAR Champs where a 50 point play was never in play during the finals

I was pointing out how I thought you said no "robots" would be strictly cyclers, but you said "alliances". I can read better now.

[Racer26]

Couple of things:

1) There will be no all Canadian alliance, and certainly not one capable of reaching Einstein.

There will probably be some alliances that are 2/3 Canadian, and one of those alliances may even make Einstein, but no Eh Team reprise. Galileo has the majority of the strong Canadians (610, 1114, 1241, 2809, 4039, 4069), with Curie coming second (1310, 2056, 4814), and Archi has 1334.

1114 is the strongest in Galileo, but none of the Canadians in G have enough strength in auto to seed #1. Most likely, Galileo's #1 alliance will be 118/1114.

2056 is strong enough to seed #1 in Curie, but they're not going to be looking for another ground pickup that does the 7-under-the-pyramid (like 1310 does). 1310 or 2056 would have to learn how to do a wing-to-wing 5 disc auto if they're to be allied. 67's FCS+1114-esque climb-n-dump is deadly, and would probably be a stronger ally than 1310, even with a wing-to-wing. Yes, 1310 has a FCS too, but its not as quick or accurate as 67's.

2) It is unlikely that 1114 will remain the only 4 digit team to win.

Too much of the strong firepower comes from newer teams for 1114 to remain the highest numbered team to win. About the only way I can see this continuing is if Archimedes is our eventual champions, with an alliance of 254/469/[other sub-1000 team (maybe 11,33,51,71,365, or 910)]

3) There will be at least two Canadian teams on Einstein, with possibly as many as 4, but they will all come from Curie and Galileo.

Obviously the easy choice would be to suggest that 1114 and 2056 make Einstein, but its likely that 1310, 4814, 1241, 610, 4039, or 4069 could end up along for the ride, regardless of if 1114 or 2056 make it.

[Bdf809]

I'm not going to attempt to predict the 2nd picks of each alliance because there's no telling what would be available or what goes through the minds of the alliance captains, but here's my picks:

Archimedes: 254 and 987

Curie: 2056 and 1717

Galileo: 1114 and 118

Newton: 1986 and 2054

Einstein: Galileo over Newton, Archimedes over Curie
Archimedes over Galileo

[R.C.]

Originally Posted by XaulZan11

Have they done this in a match yet? The couple matches I saw they didn't pick up any extra discs.

We had issues with your gyro/turn controller blowing up, tuned it on an un level practice field our last comp. We have front 7 and the back 5 working.

-RC

Originally Posted by TeamRock

Did you watch any of their matches? and no i'm not talking about their deceiving Tessier video. Yes they are capable of all what you say WHEN it works. If there ground pick ups soooo fast how come they don't really use it (because they clog easily). Most matches their Auto either doesn't work or it misses allot. They can easily be flustered by D-fence. They can only make about 4 cycles with no D-fence but they rarely make all of them. Their hanging is pitiful and i haven't seen many successful hangs. There were matches that they didn't even scour.

I'm not saying that they won't be up there in the ranks, I'm just saying that in order for them to be the first alliance's first pick they will have to be allot more reliable!

Did YOU watch any of their matches? We personally competed with them at Silicon Valley. I watched their robot from 10 feet away. They do everything Gregor listed, and more. Please become more informed about a team before blatantly dismissing them as deceiving and weak.

[nlknauss]

Originally Posted by DevenStonow

But also keep in mind there were no FCS's in MAR Champs finals (2729 don't count as they were a cycler 99% of the time), and each alliance had one ground pickup.

Presuming our camera/dashboard is back in action we're hopeful to change that 99% to a 75% or less!

I wouldn't dismiss the effectiveness of cyclers in the playoffs, especially when you consider the amount of discs left on the floor at the end of autonomous mode and the first 30 seconds of the match following. A cycler that is capable of making full court shots may be a good choice for an alliance with one or two floor pickup. The cycler can take full court shots and the misses can be gobbled up by the floor pickups. That has been our strategy throughout the season.

The other thing here is that all of the shots taken have to be quality shots with low possibility of error. This is especially important for the floor pick-up bots because they don't want to pick the same disc up more than once.

Nate

[EricDrost]

Originally Posted by TeamRock

Mabbie you saw something i didn't. Sorry. All that i have been able to see is their scours and videos off of http://www.thebluealliance.com/team/118. im not saying that they are "weak" im just sayin that i have seen better teams like 1114,254 (They climb 30 in like 8 seconds) 245, 27, and a couple more that im forgetting.

The discussion was specifically about Galileo. Who do you believe would be the best first pick partner for 1114 in Galileo? Because I (and a number of other people here) see it as 118 going into the event.

Edit: Yes yes, I agree. A team with more auto points has a great shot of seeding above 1114 (possibly even 118).

[Cory]

Originally Posted by TeamRock

Mabbie you saw something i didn't. Sorry. All that i have been able to see is their scours and videos off of http://www.thebluealliance.com/team/118. im not saying that they are "weak" im just sayin that i have seen better teams like 1114,254 (They climb 30 in like 8 seconds) 245, 27, and a couple more that im forgetting.

You are not very objective. 118 was better than us at SVR by every measurable except climb points (which isn't apples to apples). They were extremely good.

They were the highest scoring robot at SVR in autonomous and teleop points-averaging about 80 disc points per match, IIRC.

[z_beeblebrox]

Originally Posted by EricDrost

The discussion was specifically about Galileo. Who do you believe would be the best first pick for 1114 in Galileo? Because I (and a number of other people here) see it as 118 going into the event.

As discussed above, it seems unlikely that 1114 will be first seed, as they only get 18 in autonomous. However, 1114 will probably be an excellent first pick for the first seed.

[Anupam Goli]

Originally Posted by TeamRock

Did you watch any of their matches? and no i'm not talking about their deceiving Tessier video. Yes they are capable of all what you say WHEN it works. If there ground pick ups soooo fast how come they don't really use it (because they clog easily). Most matches their Auto either doesn't work or it misses allot. They can easily be flustered by D-fence. They can only make about 4 cycles with no D-fence but they rarely make all of them. Their hanging is pitiful and i haven't seen many successful hangs. There were matches that they didn't even scour.

I'm not saying that they won't be up there in the ranks, I'm just saying that in order for them to be the first alliance's first pick they will have to be allot more reliable!

118 is perhaps the most consistent robot out there, behind 1986. Ever since Lone Star, they've been able to guarantee themselves a regional victory and either the first seed or first pick. It takes a lot of skill to be able to do that at 3 different events, and Silicon Valley was one of the most stacked regionals this year. At championships, 118 will guarantee a 7 disc auto, 4-5 cycles in teleop, and a 10 point. 4 cycles is a lot, and if i recall, they do 4 cycles with plenty of defense. It seems like little defense because their drivetrain and driving skills are that good.
Also, 469 prefers to cycle despite an excellent ground pickup, and no one is going around saying 469 has a slow pickup. If you have 4 frisbees far away from eachother, it's easier to go to the feeder station and get 4 instead of driving around the entire field scouring for discs. If you noticed, 254 and 2056 always had a supply of discs close to their scoring location.

[zzzag]

Originally Posted by Dominick Ferone

353 did have some easy matches but others we had to do all the work and carry our alliance and we have since modified our bot to do 60-80 points a match

I'm sorry, I really don't see it. 10 climb points + 18 autonomous + ??????
As the strategist whose team did a pretty good job of allowing you only one cycle in one of the qualification matches, I thought playing defense against you and preventing those cycles wasn't that difficult. And the 18 point autonomous is going to be pretty well neutralized in St. Louis.

I'm going to point to a few matches: Quals 25 (teamed with two 30 point climbers, managed 42 points total) and Quals 83 (an embarrassing 31 point total, of which I'm pretty sure our autonomous was responsible for 6-12).