Shooting by Edward Jones Dome

[Tungrus]

Shooting and violence rarely happens in Detroit Downtown where FORD field, Joe Louis and COBO are located! International Autoshow, and other major events is testimony for this.

Yes, Detroit city itself has its share of violence either due to drug peddlers or teens. CMP may be a good idea to motivate these teens into attending school, don't you think?

[DELurker]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

This also isn't the first time something like this has happened. Way back in 2009 a guy committed suicide by cop in Centennial Park during the Einstein Finals. ... Also in 2012 there was a mass shooting at a medical clinic across the street during the Pittsburgh regional (2 people shot dead) that caused a lock down on the event and an evacuation of the people in the clinic to the arena.

Last year, there was a police action (their words) outside the MAR Championships at Temple University. It's a known risk of any urban (and many non-urban) area.

[coalhot]

Originally Posted by DELurker

Last year, there was a police action (their words) outside the MAR Championships at Temple University. It's a known risk of any urban (and many non-urban) area.

Yeah, though there is almost always police action in Philly around Temple. I don't think it's something that you'll ever be able to get rid of.

Hope everyone in St Louis is all right, and has a fun time at the Championships!

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by coalhot

Yeah, though there is almost always police action in Philly around Temple. I don't think it's something that you'll ever be able to get rid of.

Hope everyone in St Louis is all right, and has a fun time at the Championships!

Most of the Drexel/Temple/UPenn students actually find it odd if they don't get a few text alerts per week

[DELurker]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

Most of the Drexel/Temple/UPenn students actually find it odd if they don't get a few text alerts per week

I think it says something sad that I actually laughed out loud at that ...

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by coalhot

Yeah, though there is almost always police action in Philly around Temple. I don't think it's something that you'll ever be able to get rid of.

Hope everyone in St Louis is all right, and has a fun time at the Championships!

Temple also isn't in the heart of downtown Philadelphia. It's a relatively nice area, but it's on the border of some less reputable neighborhoods. The Edwards Jones Dome is in a much nicer part of St. Louis.

[ablatner]

At least there hasn't been a tornado and thunderstorm to lock down the Edwards Jones Dome.

[brightmidnight]

Have any of you suggesting Atlanta or Orlando instead of St. Louis due to perceived lack of crime actually been to the downtown areas of either of those two cities? I suspect not.

St. Louis gets a bad rap crime statistic-wise because the city limits are legally restricted to a small land area size - while other cities just expand and take in more suburban areas, the city of St. Louis legally cannot. Since FBI crime statistics are taken by total number of crimes divided by city area size, St. Louis comes out higher than it accurately should.

Atlanta is a sprawling city that gets to count its nice suburban areas in its crime statistics because it has annexed them as part of the city. It is 132 square miles, while St. Louis is 62 square miles. Believe me, if St. Louis could take 70 additional miles of suburban St. Louis County and divide its crime rate by that land size, there is absolutely no way Atlanta would have "less" crime than St. Louis. Orlando is 110 square miles, same phenomenon.

Bottom line - FIRST attendees are as safe as they would be in the downtown area of any city, if not safer. St. Louis does not have a history of violence at major events, like Cardinals games and that sort of thing, and its crime is generally confined to certain neighborhoods, not prime areas of downtown. That's why it is major news when anything happens downtown.

[Camren]

Originally Posted by Steve W

Toronto is a great place. Come visit and bring Champs with you.

A Canadian championship would be very intriguing.

[Gregor]

Originally Posted by Steve W

Toronto is a great place. Come visit and bring Champs with you.

I like this idea, lets do that.

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by Gregor

I like this idea, lets do that.

How quickly we forget that most Americans don't have a passport... (Yeah, it's unfair, but it's a reality that FIRST would have to deal with.)

[Karibou]

Originally Posted by Tungrus

Shooting and violence rarely happens in Detroit Downtown where FORD field, Joe Louis and COBO are located! International Autoshow, and other major events is testimony for this.

Yes, Detroit city itself has its share of violence either due to drug peddlers or teens. CMP may be a good idea to motivate these teens into attending school, don't you think?

I re-read this post a few times waiting for the sarcasm to hit me, but it didn't. Hopefully there was some there, because Detroit is one of the last places I would want to see CMP move to. Since we're already talking about dangerous cities...I'm going to actually respond to this.

While shooting and violence aren't as prolific downtown by the sports venues (for lack of a better general term), that doesn't mean they don't happen and that that it's a safe area. More safe than many other areas of Detroit, but that doesn't make it great. Most of downtown is actually a really, really nice place during the day (Midtown, museum district, sports venues, RenCen area), but I would be more concerned about at night. It's always a little worrisome to be wrangling a group of students at night in a large city, and the same concerns apply to Detroit.

I just looked at the crime statistics for both St. Louis and Detroit, and they don't differ as much as I originally thought, but there's a lot of other factors that make it a bad choice for a host city. Crime aside, there's also a lack of nearby (cost-effective) hotels and fast food joints, a pretty terrible police department, expensive parking near all of the large venues, lack of trailer/bus parking, and some pretty bad driving*. The city just doesn't have the means to support an event of this scale - the Auto Show attracts a huge (mostly adult, mind you) audience, but it doesn't have an audience that needs to stay nearby overnight for several nights without breaking the bank.

*Side story: I was watching the news once, and it was live reporting from a street in downtown Detroit. You could clearly see the cars passing on the road behind the reporter...and you could also clearly see a van doing a completely illegal U-turn in the middle of a busy road. No big deal. Again, bad driving.

[dtengineering]

Originally Posted by pfreivald

How quickly we forget that most Americans don't have a passport... (Yeah, it's unfair, but it's a reality that FIRST would have to deal with.)

Neither do most Canadians... but we're happy to get one so we can visit our neighbours.

Besides... Americans don't actually need a passport to get into Canada, only to get back home. Which, admittedly, is something of a big deal to most people. Minors, however, travelling as part of a school or community group, don't even require a passport to get home.

Come up to Canada... where shoot outs happen only when the game isn't settled in overtime.*

Jason

*Yes, that's a joke. Our gang members like to shoot each other, too.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by ablatner

At least there hasn't been a tornado and thunderstorm to lock down the Edwards Jones Dome.

Coming soon.

[pfreivald]

Originally Posted by dtengineering

Neither do most Canadians... but we're happy to get one so we can visit our neighbours.

A. You responded to me with your 1551st post. Awesome.
B. I have an enhanced driver's license, so it's no big deal to me, but I also live on a border state. Most FRC adults do not.

I'm not saying it's a non-circumventable problem, I'm just saying it's an obstacle that needs to be considered. Personally, I'd love to see CMP in Toronto!