Teams that do not bag their robots

[OzzyArmas]

What should be done if an individual knows information about a team not bagging their Robot? What happens to the team that did not bag their Robot?

[connor.worley]

I would expect to be handled on a per-case basis. Did the team work on the robot? Were there other circumstances?

[Steven Donow]

Technically, they would not pass inspection, which (probably) means they would not be allowed to compete in the event.

I've yet to hear of this happening, but does anyone (probably inspectors at new events filled with first year teams) have a tale of this happening and what was done?

[nicholsjj]

Now a team should not have any reason that I'm aware of to bag their robot now that the season is over. Do some offseason events require it? If a team has an improper bag and tag for any reason(ie. not bagging their robot in the first place) then they are required to go through the noncomplience process in which I believe the LRI Head Ref and FTA(?) all have to understand the team's explination on way they didn't handle bag and tag properly. The team will then sometimes be assesed a time penealty in which they are not allowed to work on the robot. One of the most interesting stories that Razorback had was team 1912 having a very large hole in the bag around their drivetrain from shipping. We laughed about it and got them through the process quickly because they were honest about it and contacted the Regional as soon as the hole was discovered.

[EricH]

Competition robot, or practice robot?

If it's a practice robot, that's one thing--those are fair game.

But if the competition robot isn't bagged...it would depend on who informs FRC HQ, and whether the team does work on the robot between bag day and competition, and the state of the lockup form on arrival at competition. It's a mess, but it can be worked through.

[Boe]

not the most relevant considering the original poster was from miami, but for the minnesota state championship in mid may your robot must have stayed bagged, but you are allowed 8 hours (i think) with the robot out of the bag before the event

[EricH]

Originally Posted by nicholsjj

Now a team should not have any reason that I'm aware of to bag their robot now that the season is over. Do some offseason events require it?

Yes, actually. MN State Championship requires it, or so I hear. I think there are a couple of other state championship events starting up that will/do require bagged robots. These are not FRC events, but they use the bag to prevent extra work on the robot before the event.

[CENTURION]

What exactly are you saying OzzyArmas? They didn't bag it at all? If so, they wouldn't pass inspection.

Or are you saying that they kept working on it after stop build, and then bagged it up just before the regional? (And falsified the paperwork?)

[OzzyArmas]

Sorry I delayed so much, I've been a little busy and couldn't find this post again.
The Robot was bagged, but then they asked for permission to un-bag it to do a "presentation" when in reality it was to keep working on it. This happened after build season was done and during competition season. The Robot was never finished on time.

[Steven Donow]

Originally Posted by OzzyArmas

Sorry I delayed so much, I've been a little busy and couldn't find this post again.
The Robot was bagged, but then they asked for permission to un-bag it to do a "presentation" when in reality it was to keep working on it. This happened after build season was done and during competition season. The Robot was never finished on time.

Interestingly enough, I believe FIRST has given exemptions for the case of presentation. There was a Q&A question about it, and it's handled on a case-by-case basis through emailing FIRST. Also I vaguely recall a story here about a team allowed to unbag at the request of a FIRST higherup(Woodie? Jon Dudas? Dean?) in order to present their robot...
Of course, these were all with the expressed consent of FIRST, and I assume some proof had to be provided that no work was done...

[OzzyArmas]

That's the thing. The "proof" was fake. According to the "proof", the robot was bagged thr same day. According to my proof and what I saw/know, it was bagged right before competition.

[EricH]

So submit your proof to FRC HQ. If there was a violation as severe as you are alleging, then FRC HQ needs to know about it (even if they do not want to know about it). They will presumably investigate and deal with it appropriately.

Coming here on Chief Delphi to comment on it does nothing official, and can raise some hackles. Go to FRC HQ with your evidence, whatever it is, and let them deal with it. I won't say it's not going to be difficult, but it is at least the professional thing to do, and quite possibly the gracious thing to do.

[Racer26]

Knowing the way the B&T system is constructed, I'm amazed that nobody else thinks this happens on a regular basis.

IMO HQ should require us to submit a digital photograph of the robot in its bag, with the numbered tag visible within 24 hours of bag day. Then its much harder to abuse the system.

As it is now, there is absolutely nothing (except y'know, morals) to stop a team from working on their robot right up until their competition, and bag the robot the night before, having a mentor sign the paper saying it was in on bag day.

[martin417]

Originally Posted by Racer26

Knowing the way the B&T system is constructed, I'm amazed that nobody else thinks this happens on a regular basis.

IMO HQ should require us to submit a digital photograph of the robot in its bag, with the numbered tag visible within 24 hours of bag day. Then its much harder to abuse the system.

As it is now, there is absolutely nothing (except y'know, morals) to stop a team from working on their robot right up until their competition, and bag the robot the night before, having a mentor sign the paper saying it was in on bag day.

You mean you think there are people in this world that would cheat? Shocking! Next you will be telling me that there are athletes out there using performance enhancing drugs, then lying about it. I just can't believe that would ever happen!

[CENTURION]

Originally Posted by martin417

You mean you think there are people in this world that would cheat? Shocking! Next you will be telling me that there are athletes out there using performance enhancing drugs, then lying about it. I just can't believe that would ever happen!

The FIRST culture is much different though. Personally, I don't have a problem trusting teams to properly B&T.

The mentors should know that they're really just cheating the students though.