Go to Post Drive fast...drive true...otherwise it will kind of crush you - techhelpbb [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > FIRST > General Forum
Reload this Page 2013 Qual Schedule Analysis
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-05-2013, 17:24
MikeE's Avatar
MikeE MikeE is offline
Wrecking nice beaches since 1990
no team (Volunteer)
Team Role: Engineer
  
Join Date: Nov 2008
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: New England -> Alaska
Posts: 381
MikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2013 Qual Schedule Analysis
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeE View Post
With only 8 matches and a field of 100 any reasonable optimization algorithm should converge to the same general solution: play with 16 different teams and against 24 other different teams.
That solution will always give the same summary statistics.
...although that's not what the schedule summaries are showing, since a pair of teams do play each other more than once.
So I reverse my conclusion.
Reply With Quote
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-05-2013, 17:59
Joe Ross's Avatar Unsung FIRST Hero
Joe Ross Joe Ross is offline
Registered User
FRC #0330 (Beachbots)
Team Role: Engineer
  
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1997
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,570
Joe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond reputeJoe Ross has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2013 Qual Schedule Analysis
It appears that the match scheduler does not care about multiple opponents/partners in surrogate matches. I checked the Archimedes schedule and the teams that had multiple opponents played each other once in their surrogate match and once in a match that counted.

Here is the scheduler's analysis of the Archimedes schedule, which does not show repeats in matches that count.

Code:
Schedule Statistics
-------------------

          #: number of matches played, a '+' after the number
               indicates one additional round as a surrogate
          d: minimum delta between matches (e.g. '1' means back-to-back)
       part: number of distinct partners followed by most frequent repeat count
        opp: number of distinct opponents followed by most frequent repeat count

       both: number of distinct teams seen as partner or opponent
               followed by most frequent combined repeat count
        r/b: balance between red and blue alliance appearances
               eg, 3b means team appeared as blue 3 times more than as red
 4+ repeats: any teams seen four or more times as partners or opponents

 team   #   d    part    opp    both    r/b   4+ repeats
 ----  --  --   -----   -----   -----   ---   ------------
   11:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   20:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   33:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   51:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   71:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
   78:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  126:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  172:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  236:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  254:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  291:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  314:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  316:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  321:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  326:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  365:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  379:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  433:  8+ 11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  469:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  525:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  639:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  694:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  701:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  801:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  812:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  836:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  840:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  846:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  868:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  910:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  930:  8+  9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  948:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  955:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  973:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  987:  8+  8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1011:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1071:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1075:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1100:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1334:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1448:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1519:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1595:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1610:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1660:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 1714:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1747:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1756:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1796:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1836:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1868:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1902:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1967:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 2016:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2081:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2137:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2165:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2408:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2415:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2457:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2468:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2486:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2543:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2590:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2604:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2614:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2704:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2705:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2709:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2959:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3003:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3008:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3044:  8+  8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3145:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3242:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3245:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3310:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3314:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3467:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3478:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3504:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3612:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3627:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4067:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4265:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4450:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4466:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4470:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 4471:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 4499:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4501:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4537:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4545:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4585:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4589:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4637:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4673:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 4731:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4753:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 4810:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
-------------------------------------
 best:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
worst:  9   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2  (38)
Last edited by Joe Ross : 01-05-2013 at 18:01.
Reply With Quote
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-05-2013, 18:16
MikeE's Avatar
MikeE MikeE is offline
Wrecking nice beaches since 1990
no team (Volunteer)
Team Role: Engineer
  
Join Date: Nov 2008
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: New England -> Alaska
Posts: 381
MikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond reputeMikeE has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2013 Qual Schedule Analysis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Ross View Post
It appears that the match scheduler does not care about multiple opponents/partners in surrogate matches. I checked the Archimedes schedule and the teams that had multiple opponents played each other once in their surrogate match and once in a match that counted.

Here is the scheduler's analysis of the Archimedes schedule, which does not show repeats in matches that count.

Code:
Schedule Statistics
-------------------

          #: number of matches played, a '+' after the number
               indicates one additional round as a surrogate
          d: minimum delta between matches (e.g. '1' means back-to-back)
       part: number of distinct partners followed by most frequent repeat count
        opp: number of distinct opponents followed by most frequent repeat count

       both: number of distinct teams seen as partner or opponent
               followed by most frequent combined repeat count
        r/b: balance between red and blue alliance appearances
               eg, 3b means team appeared as blue 3 times more than as red
 4+ repeats: any teams seen four or more times as partners or opponents

 team   #   d    part    opp    both    r/b   4+ repeats
 ----  --  --   -----   -----   -----   ---   ------------
   11:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   20:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   33:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   51:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
   71:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
   78:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  126:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  172:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  236:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  254:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  291:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  314:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  316:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  321:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  326:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  365:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  379:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  433:  8+ 11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  469:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  525:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  639:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  694:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  701:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  801:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  812:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  836:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  840:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  846:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  868:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
  910:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
  930:  8+  9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  948:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  955:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  973:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
  987:  8+  8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1011:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1071:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1075:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1100:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1334:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1448:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1519:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1595:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1610:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1660:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 1714:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1747:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1756:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1796:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1836:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1868:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 1902:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 1967:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 2016:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2081:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2137:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2165:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2408:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2415:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2457:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2468:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2486:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2543:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 2590:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2604:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2614:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2704:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2705:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2709:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 2959:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3003:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3008:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3044:  8+  8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3145:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3242:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3245:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3310:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3314:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3467:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3478:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 3504:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 3612:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 3627:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4067:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4265:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4450:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4466:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4470:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 4471:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
 4499:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4501:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4537:  8  10 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4545:  8  13 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4585:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4589:  8  11 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4637:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4673:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 4731:  8   9 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
 4753:  8  12 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2b
 4810:  8   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2r
-------------------------------------
 best:  8  14 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  0
worst:  9   8 | 16  1 | 24  1 | 40  1 |  2  (38)
That pattern continues in all 4 divisions and several other schedules based on 8 matches from 100 teams. The surrogate teams also appear in the last match in all cases I've looked at, so I suspect that's an artifact of the initial population of the matches.

So I think we're back to there being no evidence that the matches were not generated randomly with the standard scheduling algorithm.
Reply With Quote
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 01-05-2013, 18:44
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
  
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 8,086
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2013 Qual Schedule Analysis

At Razorback, there were 101 pairs of teams who played against each other twice.

There were 17 pairs of teams who played against each other 3 times.

There were 217 pairs of team who did not play against each other.

Each team played exactly 12 matches, so I assume there were no surrogates (or am I misunderstanding what a surrogate is, in this context?).


Reply With Quote
Reply

« Previous Thread | Portal | Next Thread »

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Hybrid Mode Hybrid Mode
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:47.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.

Contact Us - Chief Delphi - Rules - Archive - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi