[FTC]: FTC Super-Regionals

[Joe G.]

Like it or not, this is the direction that things have to go in. Championships, for FTC and FRC, can't get much bigger. The simple truth is that championships is going to become harder and harder to get to, and this is a better solution than further cuts to the qualification criteria (If this means that all 3 members of winning regional alliances will quality for these events again, I will be THRILLED.) I would expect FRC to move in a similar direction soon as well.

I think it would be interesting if these "Super Regionals" became combined events much like the World Championship, with FLL, FTC, and FRC represented under the same roof. This would cut travel costs for teams that participate in both, and give these super regionals a championship event feeling.

[iPenguin]

Originally Posted by Joe G.

I think it would be interesting if these "Super Regionals" became combined events much like the World Championship, with FLL, FTC, and FRC represented under the same roof. This would cut travel costs for teams that participate in both, and give these super regionals a championship event feeling.

The problem with all those combined regionals is staffing. There aren't enough volunteers to meet the needed capacity. Plus, some volunteers (like myself) like to volunteer at both FRC and FTC events, and some like to do all three.

The other problem with combined regionals is WiFi traffic. When you have several dozen FRC bots and several dozen FTC bots in the same area, they do not play nice with each other. I know specifically during this past year at the Alamo Regional, they also ran one of their Texas State FTC Tournaments, and there were numerous problems on the field due to a high volume of WiFi traffic.

[maths222]

To throw some numbers at everyone:

At nationals, there are 128 teams, 64 per division. I figure a super-regional will have up to 64 teams, no more. 20-25 teams advancing per super-regional (according to an official blog comment) = 80-100 from super-regionals combined. This year 26 teams were international; I figure the number will only go up for next year.

[pyroslev]

So in Virginia, does this mean teams from West Virginia and North Carolina that hop over the border to our events can't anymore? I know some states have closed borders cause they have enough teams in state already. Wonder how this will affect all that.

[orangemoore]

I am not excited about this because it is going to make it so much harder for my team to have an opportunity to compete that the world championship. Instead of taking 2 two events to get to the world championship it is going to take 3. My team is in Illinois and our competition is November and December so our robot building time frame is severely shortened.

[Joe G.]

Originally Posted by orangemoore

I am not excited about this because it is going to make it so much harder for my team to have an opportunity to compete that the world championship. Instead of taking 2 two events to get to the world championship it is going to take 3. My team is in Illinois and our competition is November and December so our robot building time frame is severely shortened.

It becomes harder to make the world championships every year, on the basis of more teams entering FTC and teams getting better. This will give more teams the opportunity to play elite-level events, and do a better job at selecting those to advance further to the world championship.

[JohnFogarty]

Let me explain some of the reasons for this change that I know of because I've been talking with some staff at FIRST about creating a system like this for well over a year.

1. The Ability for deserving teams to compete more at a higher level.
We all know there are FTC teams that travel out of state and beyond their own state championship to gain experience and to try for last chance tickets at the world championship. However, it has been the experience of the teams within those states that out of state teams usually that have competed 2-3 times before come in and "clean the floor" with the in state teams, leaving them with no ability to compete at a higher level. Thus the super regional is brought into the picture. This allows/closes states in order to helm them advance their own teams to the regional event and finally allows events to advance whole alliances instead of just alliance captains. Then the super-regional is an event that will have a similar level of competition to World.

2. World Championship will consist of the best teams from around the world.

I know that Global Force is excited about this change since out of our 4 State Championship titles we only we able to attend world twice.

[Andrew Schuetze]

Via FTC Facebook page today

Event details for two Super-Regional Championship Tournaments are now available!
South: San Antonio, TX; Feb. 26-28, 2014
North: Iowa City, IA; April 3-5, 2014
Learn more at http://ow.ly/mLLH2

[CENTURION]

Originally Posted by John_1102

1. The Ability for deserving teams to compete more at a higher level.
We all know there are FTC teams that travel out of state and beyond their own state championship to gain experience and to try for last chance tickets at the world championship. However, it has been the experience of the teams within those states that out of state teams usually that have competed 2-3 times before come in and "clean the floor" with the in state teams, leaving them with no ability to compete at a higher level. Thus the super regional is brought into the picture. This allows/closes states in order to helm them advance their own teams to the regional event and finally allows events to advance whole alliances instead of just alliance captains. Then the super-regional is an event that will have a similar level of competition to World.

(emphasis mine)

So this system will lock in states so out-of-state teams can't compete at other state's regionals? I would love that. Currently, Wisconsin doesn't have enough teams to require qualifying events, so out-of-state teams see the WI regional as an easy target, because they don't have to qualify for it. And as a result, Wisconsin teams didn't get to advance.

[Andrew Schuetze]

Originally Posted by iPenguin

The problem with all those combined regionals is staffing. There aren't enough volunteers to meet the needed capacity. Plus, some volunteers (like myself) like to volunteer at both FRC and FTC events, and some like to do all three.

The other problem with combined regionals is WiFi traffic. When you have several dozen FRC bots and several dozen FTC bots in the same area, they do not play nice with each other. I know specifically during this past year at the Alamo Regional, they also ran one of their Texas State FTC Tournaments, and there were numerous problems on the field due to a high volume of WiFi traffic.

Just wanted to follow up on this post from the early discussion in this thread. Staffing was and is always an issue. We were fortunate at the South Super-Regional to have many FTC heavy hitters from all across the South as well as strong support from the Texas and Oklahoma FTC partners. If you have the time and ability, I urge the FTC community to volunteer at the North, East, and/or West Super-Regional this year as FTC needs your support. Log into VIMS and sign up. I think a link was sent out recently. If I find it, I'll add a new post with just the links. Others who may have the links are welcome to post it before me if able.

In regards to wifi, we learned a lot from the previous three years of running the combined events here in San Antonio. This year was our best year in that regard. We were able to increase the number and types of technology we used to monitor, detect and decrease the amount of wifi traffic in the competition space. Three big efforts included: the use of Fluke meters with directional functionality to quickly locate hotspots, placing FTC fields in a ballroom with a physical wall separating the competition fields from all the FRC and FTC pits as well as the FRC fields, and more FTAs and a one man wifi sniffer supported by web-based monitoring equipment at HQ. The grand total of hotspots detected and shut down during 2 full days of competition was 50! One from a FRC coach in the stands of the FRC field who didn't understand why it was an issue. We also sent out a crack crew of veteran FRC teams to all of the FRC rookies on Thursday, FRC inspection day, to help the rookies understand what "bridge mode" is and how to set up their robot for competition. This would have been caught during FRC robot inspections, but rookies tend to be the last in that line so we wanted to catch that issue sooner rather than later.

End result, this year with more FTC teams and the same number of 64 FRC teams in the space, we ran our two division event without many replays due to technology. We consistently ran 12 matches per hour which averages to 5 minute turns. Not checking FTA post action reports and going from memory, I think our first technology related replay came during the elimination rounds and was due to a faulty joystick.

FRC and FTC can coexist but it takes more volunteers and more technology as well as some prudent logistics to make it work as well as we were able to this season at the Alamo FRC regional / FTC South Super-Regional Championship.