What does your team do during the summer?

[Navid Shafa]

Originally Posted by waialua359

-After a visit last week at FRC Headquarters and seeing the latest equipment that Dean Kamen has purchased, I am inspired to be the 1st High School to get the same, if possible, which I found WAY more cool than a Waterjet.

Do tell! :O

[bbradf44]

I have heard about teams who use the off season to perfect things like swerve drive and other mechanisms. I'm trying to get my mentors to approve off season prototyping but they keep quoting the rule that says whatever you build in the off season cant be used on the competition bot. How do teams work on things like swerve without being in violation of that rule? Surly you cant build a whole new swerve drive in the 6 weeks?

[androb4]

It is true that what you build during offseason, you cannot use for the next season. But there is more to it. If you DESIGN a gearbox or a swerve drive offseason etc., it must be publicly available in order for you to use it the next season. (I'm not sure if a picture/illustration counts, or it has to be a CAD/drawing.)

Edit: ..to my knowledge.

[Jay O'Donnell]

As far as I'm aware...
You can build/prototype things (swerve drive, mecanum drive, etc.) as long as what you build does not go on any future competing robots. As long as you aren't starting the build of any part of your robot, you are in the clear.

[Domenic Rodriguez]

Section 4.1.4 - Fabrication Schedule

Originally Posted by The Manual

R16 - ROBOT elements, including software, that are designed or created before Kickoff are not permitted, unless they are publicly available prior to Kickoff.

If you read the blue box for clarification under the rule, it lists some more specific examples of what you can and cannot do. Basically, you can design and build prototypes and such in the offseason, but you can't then use the exact prototype you built on a robot, unless it is publicly available prior to Kickoff. This applies to both hardware and software.

[Pault]

Never underestimate teams. Your mentors are right that nothing you build before the build season can be used on the competition robot. And there is no way (at least in the spirit of gracious professionalism) to get around that rule. In fact, there are limitations to what you can do with CAD models that you make during the offseason. Of course, the rules about that could change next year, but the chances of that happening are slim and not something you should expect.

So yes, teams really do build swerve drives in the offseason just to do it all again during the build season. And not just swerve drives. Building practice robots in the offseason is a practice that countless good and great teams do. Why? Because the offseason is a time to try out new things, to train your students, and to get new students excited about the upcoming season. And in my opinion (and I'm definitely not alone in this opinion), a practice robot is the best way to accomplish these things.

I'm saying this because I know from experience. Last year, my team didn't get to build an offseason robot, and test out a new idea we had. But when the build season came, we decided we wanted to use this new idea even though it was untested. So about halfway through the build season, we realized that BECAUSE WE DIDN'T PRACTICE IT IN THE OFFSEASON, weren't going to be able to do it in time, and had to scrap the idea and with most of our progress. From there, everything just became a disaster for our team, trying to make up for the time we had lost. We ended up working ~75 hours during the last 7 days of build, and yet we still failed and ended up finishing our robot at our first competition; we didn't even get to compete very much. As a result, our robot never reached its full potential, and although my team still had an awesome season, it could have been MUCH better, if only we had built that practice robot.

Edit: I need to learn that every post doesn't need to be a full out essay

[bbradf44]

I'm in no way trying to get past this rule. A couple of teammates and i would like to build a practice bot using many new ideas that we have found reading through the forums(swerve, octocanum, elevators things like that) to eventually use on a competition robot. i was just looking for clarification on what i need to do to be able to use these ideas in competition. Do we just need to post a cad on here? Should we avoid building a functional prototype?

[Jay O'Donnell]

Originally Posted by bbradf44

I'm in no way trying to get past this rule. A couple of teammates and i would like to build a practice bot using many new ideas that we have found reading through the forums(swerve, octocanum, elevators things like that) to eventually use on a competition robot. i was just looking for clarification on what i need to do to be able to use these ideas in competition. Do we just need to post a cad on here? Should we avoid building a functional prototype?

If you plan on using whatever you build in the offseason directly on your robot, a picture of the prototype or a CAD drawing should be acceptable. If you are just building something to try things, but know it will not be an actual part of your robot, then there's no need (although I'm sure chief Delphi wouldn't mind seeing your work!)

[cad321]

Originally Posted by bbradf44

I'm in no way trying to get past this rule. A couple of teammates and i would like to build a practice bot using many new ideas that we have found reading through the forums(swerve, octocanum, elevators things like that) to eventually use on a competition robot. i was just looking for clarification on what i need to do to be able to use these ideas in competition. Do we just need to post a cad on here? Should we avoid building a functional prototype?

From what I can tell (reading through the rules and CD) it would appear that you can build whatever you like in the offseason however, what you build cant go on a competition robot. If you build something you want on a competition robot in the offseason, you must rebuild another one during the build season.

[evanperryg]

We meet during the offseason around 2 days a week. A lot of it is for team members to hone their skills (CADing a swerve module, trying to lay out the entire electrical system in a tiny space, driving around a kitbot drivetrain) or for team members to learn new skills. We also look back at the previous season and work on ways that we can improve (changing up the pit, developing scouting spreadsheets of god-tier complexity, things like that). During the fall, new members compete in a vex-scale competition held by a local team (1625). It helps introduce new members to the high-intensity build process and competition.

[Stark4Prez23]

Originally Posted by evanperryg

We meet during the offseason around 2 days a week. A lot of it is for team members to hone their skills (CADing a swerve module, trying to lay out the entire electrical system in a tiny space, driving around a kitbot drivetrain) or for team members to learn new skills. We also look back at the previous season and work on ways that we can improve (changing up the pit, developing scouting spreadsheets of god-tier complexity, things like that). During the fall, new members compete in a vex-scale competition held by a local team (1625). It helps introduce new members to the high-intensity build process and competition.

The impact we see is great, because if we recruit students early, they get to get used to the team dynamic. It's also a great way of forming ties with local teams by participating in offseason events. Last year we increased training for all members during the offseason with student leaders and mentors leading small projects. We saw principles we learned applied successfully this year, which made our team and robot stronger than ever. It's really just a matter of setting goals for your team.

[BrendanB]

Originally Posted by bbradf44

I have heard about teams who use the off season to perfect things like swerve drive and other mechanisms. I'm trying to get my mentors to approve off season prototyping but they keep quoting the rule that says whatever you build in the off season cant be used on the competition bot. How do teams work on things like swerve without being in violation of that rule? Surly you cant build a whole new swerve drive in the 6 weeks?

Our team has a current rev of our swerve drive project (it still needs some more revs before we produce it). If our team wanted to make a swerve drive during the 2014 build season we would completely start from scratch using what we learned from our fall project to help us design it. We aren't taking files, we are taking knowledge from a previous system, finding how we can improve/refine it, and making a new one.

The reason this helps is because 6 weeks isn't enough time to design, test, and refine our first swerve drive. Its something we need to practice like programming, machining, and electrical training in the fall. Making complicated projects in the fall gives you the opportunity to really learn and dive into a projects giving different stages more time and thought you wouldn't have time for during the build season making it a better learning experience.

Your mentors are correct though, whatever you design/make before kickoff can't be used on your competition robot but you will have learned so much about making a swerve drive that making another will be very, very easy.

This rule is in place so teams don't spend 8 months of the previous year building a ton of simple and complex parts they could potentially use on their next robot or once the season starts they send out CAD files of parts they have been working on in the off-season.

New season, start over.