District Feasibility/Potential

[AGPapa]

Originally Posted by dodar

Florida has more than the Panther Prowl; I believe there are a few down south. And Florida also has a few pre-season events.

What other events are there?

[Brandon Holley]

Originally Posted by Andrew Schreiber

Regionals give you a full day to inspect all the teams. Districts substantially less. And, given that many of the teams in Florida have had me rebuilding their robots late into Friday...

These are the numbers Rich Sisk and I worked up to see how big FiM would have to be for every school district in Michigan to have a team. This was done in 2010 but the core part is still the same. (Spoiler, it gets ridiculous)

It takes 6 inspectors per event.

It takes 1 head ref, 1 LRI, 1 FTA, and 1 Judge Coordinator per event.

It takes 20-25 Judges per event. (This number cannot be reduced substantially without drastically reducing quality of judging)

It takes between 4 and 6 refs

I don't have solid numbers for queuers or pit staff, nor did I include the 2 scorekeepers, the various AV folks... and I'm fairly certain I'm forgetting some group. So, let's assume somewhere north of 60 people per event.

To run Beantown Blitz (a 1 day off-season event with ~40 teams) we pull in 55-60 volunteers. This does not include personnel like safety advisors, inspectors or a the full gambit of judges (we use a smaller staff of 10-12 for our 1 day event).

A volunteer staff for a district event is not all that different from a regional staff. In fact, the reason Beantown needs so many volunteers is that we are running many aspects that are often 'venue-handled' at a regional (concession stands, security, parking, facilities, etc). This is a very important aspect to consider as well.

-Brando

[dodar]

Originally Posted by AGPapa

What other events are there?

I dont remember the names but 1251 hosts(might be hosted) one and so does(might be did) 179.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Brandon Holley

To run Beantown Blitz (a 1 day off-season event with ~40 teams) we pull in 55-60 volunteers. This does not include personnel like safety advisors, inspectors or a the full gambit of judges (we use a smaller staff of 10-12 for our 1 day event).

I was doing the math on it earlier, and that's on the low end of what I was figuring for a regional. Replace your concession, parking, facilities, and possibly security people with inspectors and enough judges to make up a full complement, come out about even. Maybe a couple of other folks.

I then figured that about half of those would return if the second district was close enough, and guesstimated about 90-100 individual volunteers for 2 district events.

Fall Classic (1 day, 20 or so teams) pulled 15-20 volunteers or so (not counting concessions and facility staff) to run the event, and that many again for both setup and teardown. 45 people total, with about 5-10 doing setup, teardown, and the event in between, over a day and an evening. (Last year's numbers, BTW, off the top of my head, give or take a fudge factor of 5 in any given section of the event).

[DampRobot]

Originally Posted by Siri

CA: CalGames, Classic

Don't forget Madtown Throwdown and Powerhouse Pwnage! There might be one other I'm forgetting too.

[AlexD744]

Originally Posted by dodar

I dont remember the names but 1251 hosts(might be hosted) one and so does(might be did) 179.

Mission mayhem used to be an event in South Florida hosted by (if memory serves) 1345 and 108 (not sure if 1251 was involved or not as that dissolved after my freshman year of high school). I am aware of a scrimmage day that 179 has hosted in the past, not sure if that's happening still, but from my understanding it was very far from an event. More like a day to shake out the robots at the end of build. Tempest N' Tampa also used to be a great event. There was also the Robot Rodeo (a mini off-season) in Orlando, again, I'm not sure if this still exists. I also heard rumor of something brewing in Tampa for this year, but nothing more than rumor.

I would love for 744 to host an off-season in Ft. Lauderdale. Mr. Stolley's over worked as it is though, but I think we could do it eventually.

[AGPapa]

Originally Posted by dodar

I dont remember the names but 1251 hosts(might be hosted) one and so does(might be did) 179.

I can't find anything about 179 hosting an offseason. But I did find that 1251 used to host Mission Mayhem. It was canceled in 2012 because of lack of teams.

So it looks like in 2013 there is only one off-season event in Florida.
Looking at Panther Prowl, it doesn't seem to be as large as the offseason events in MAR. It only had 21 teams last year. Here Brunswick Eruption, Ramp Riot and Monty Madness are always full with around 40 teams and have waitlists to get in.

I wonder if the districts led to more offseason events or if the offseasons came first? I know that Midknight is new in MAR this year, and I'm not sure when girlPower started. So that's 3-4 offseasons in MAR before districts. Does anyone have info about Michigan's offseasons in 2008?

[Hallry]

Originally Posted by Siri

*It's interesting, MAR has 5 off-seasons in like 35K mi² (NJ+DE+.5PA): by my reckoning the highest in the world. NE is 2nd with 6 in 72K; PNW is 3 in 170K. You can actually see their "bubbles" on the calendar:
PA: girlPOWER, Riot
NJ: Monty, MidKnight, Brunswick <<I think only MN has more, and it's 10x the size (albeit 3.5M fewer people)

6! Don't forget about Duel on the Delaware, in Carney's Point, NJ!

[Pault]

Originally Posted by Siri

Good food and free t-shirts. Teams are supposed to supply 2 volunteers; sometimes college alumni are good for this. There's also been quite a few off-seasons up here* even before districts, which helps keep people engaged. 1640 alone has volunteer(s) for at least: Monty Madness, MidKnight Mayhem, girlPOWER, Duel on the Delaware, Brunswick Eruption and Ramp Riot, plus Battle 'o Baltimore (MD) and Lewis Blitz (NY).

But in all honesty, a good part of the reason FiM and MAR were the first to transition was because we had strong volunteer bases. If we're taxing bases this size, I don't envy regions that self-classify as having a small volunteer base.


*It's interesting, MAR has 5 off-seasons in like 35K mi² (NJ+DE+.5PA): by my reckoning the highest in the world. NE is 2nd with 6 in 72K; PNW is 3 in 170K. You can actually see their "bubbles" on the calendar:
ME: SPIRIT
NH: Merrimack, Rage
MA: MSHSL, Beantown
CT: Wolcott
NY: Ruckus, Lewis
PA: girlPOWER, Riot
NJ: Monty, MidKnight, Brunswick <<I think only MN has more, and it's 10x the size (albeit 3.5M fewer people)
MD: BoB
VA: Rumble
NC: THOR
SC: SCRIW
FL: Panther
LA: Stick
TX: Roundup, reMix
AR: Ozark
MO: Cow Town
IL: River
IN: Champs, IRI
OH: Connect
MI: MARC
MN: Detroit, Invt'l, Rendezvous, Champs
OR: Seattle, Generation, Rollout
CA: CalGames, Classic
Aust: DDU

This is a pretty incomplete list. Here in NE we have 8 by my count: Battlecry, Beantown Blitz, WIWI, Conneticut State Champs, Bash at the Beach, Mainly Spirit, River Rage, Mayhem in Merrimack.

I think it can be said that New England will be coming into districts with a fairly strong volunteer base.

[EricH]

California is missing a couple--as noted, MadTown and Powerhouse, but also the Battle at the Border (San Diego).

[Kpchem]

Unless I'm mistaken, the event listed as "Seattle" for Oregon is Girls Generation Seattle, which is held in Washington.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by Pault

This is a pretty incomplete list. Here in NE we have 8 by my count: Battlecry, Beantown Blitz, WIWI, Conneticut State Champs, Bash at the Beach, Mainly Spirit, River Rage, Mayhem in Merrimack.

I think it can be said that New England will be coming into districts with a fairly strong volunteer base.

Also missing a handful from Michigan...

IGVC, Kettering KICKOFF, WMRI... I think I'm missing a few still too.

[Brandon Holley]

Originally Posted by Pault

This is a pretty incomplete list. Here in NE we have 8 by my count: Battlecry, Beantown Blitz, WIWI, Conneticut State Champs, Bash at the Beach, Mainly Spirit, River Rage, Mayhem in Merrimack.

Add in Suffield Shakedown as well.

[MrTechCenter]

Originally Posted by EricH

California is missing a couple--as noted, MadTown and Powerhouse, but also the Battle at the Border (San Diego).

I'm glad to hear people actually know about us

[AlexD744]

Originally Posted by dodar

I think it would be better to wait till like 150 teams and have 10 districts(2 per week with one "week off" or 2 weeks with only one district) and a FSC. You could do: Miami, Tampa, Jacksonville, Melbourne, Boca Raton, Tallahassee, Orlando, Gainesville/Ocala, Fort Lauderdale and Daytona. That would be 3 in North Florida, 3 in South Florida, and 4 in Central Florida; then you would have the FSC in the UCF Arena or OCCC or Amway Arena.

On the topic of Florida districts:
I agree with James that Florida could feasibly pull off the districts with ~100 teams and districts spread similar to the way he described, on a similar timeline (~2016). I think as far as volunteer bases, it would be a softer transition than going directly to 10 events. Although it would be a slightly harder transition for the teams.

Also, with 150 teams, that means 300 "competing slots" as each team plays twice. At ~40 teams per district, that means only 8 districts to accommodate the number of teams suggested for transition.

If I were to organize Florida districts/championship, I would do almost exactly what James did, but instead, I would move the Tallahassee district to Gainesville. Our panhandle is similar to Michigan's upper peninsula, I don't think the five teams up there warrant a whole district event, especially since three of them didn't even opt to compete in Florida this past year, but rather competed at the Bayou regional. Although, I would like to see that area grow when the district transition happens, so that eventually a district can form up there. I like the Championship in Orlando, I don't know about the venue.

I still don't know what to do with our friends from the DR... those teams are so close to Florida and have roots in Florida FRC. I would hate to exclude them, but I just wouldn't know how to fit them into a district system without more teams (~30 on the island).

Also, since all of this is speculation, does anyone know what, if any, talk there has been in FloridaFIRST leadership in regards to districts?