Solenoid 12V Regulator on 24V Breakout?

[seg9585]

We purchased 12V solenoids to use on the robot this year, and plan to get more solenoids/valves from FIRST Choice, however we noticed FC only offers the 24V variety.
I realize you can use 2 solenoid modules on the cRio to get a 24V flavor and 12V flavor, but is it permissible to installed the 12V solenoid onto a single 24V module through a 12V voltage regulator (as a custom circuit)?

[geomapguy]

This could work:

24V solenoids through solenoid module
12V solenoids through spikes

[seg9585]

I realize that works as well, but when dealing with double solenoids you end up using a lot of relays, which adds weight and cost. Step-down voltage regulators in series would be cheaper and lighter, just trying to determine if it's legal.

[Nirvash]

I obviously wouldn't recommend it and remember one Spike can control two 12v solenoids.

From my quick check of the 2013 manual, you may have an issue with this rule.

R54
Custom circuits shall not directly alter the power pathways between the ROBOT battery, PD Board, motor controllers,
relays, motors, or other elements of the ROBOT control system (including the power pathways to other sensors or
circuits). Custom high impedance voltage monitoring or low impedance current monitoring circuitry connected to the
ROBOT’S electrical system is acceptable, if the effect on the ROBOT outputs is inconsequential.

[Cecil]

To control the double solenoid with a Spike relay, don't you just hook both positive leads from the solenoid to the 2 output terminals on the Spike and tie the ground back into the PDB? I've heard of it being done, but have never tried myself.

[geomapguy]

Originally Posted by Joe Ross

These are lighter then a 12v regulator, although probably not cheaper: http://www.andymark.com/product-p/am-0875.htm

???? Would these actually do anything for varying the voltage

[otherguy]

Originally Posted by geomapguy

???? Would these actually do anything for varying the voltage

They take in either 12 or 24vdc to drive a festo solenoid valve. Someone correct me if i'm wrong, if you purchased the 24v soelnoids from first choice, these would allow you to run them from either 12v or 24v supply.

Note that you will need to purchase two per double solenoid valve.

[geomapguy]

Originally Posted by otherguy

They take in either 12 or 24vdc to drive a festo solenoid valve. Someone correct me if i'm wrong, if you purchased the 24v soelnoids from first choice, these would allow you to run them from either 12v or 24v supply.

Note that you will need to purchase two per double solenoid valve.

Wow we'll definitely be doing this

[nuttle]

I don't think this part works this way, but the documentation I've come across isn't 100% clear on this point. My reading of things is this particular part can work with either 12 or 24V valves, but only when the applied voltage matches the specifications of the valve. There are both 12 and 24V valves in the same family that can be used with this part. In other words, this part is more like a connector and does not regulate the voltage or anything like this. I think you're stuck using valves that take the same voltage, using two pneumatics modules in your cRIO, or using a Spike for 12V and a pneumatics module for 24V. Not only would putting a voltage regulator in-line violate the rules (from past years), but this would also likely not work, at least not very well. Maybe a resistor could be used, but this would likely run into the same issues, at least with the rules.

Bottom line: I would check very carefully before trying this, particularly given the costs involved if testing destroyed a valve or one were to go bad at an event.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by otherguy

They take in either 12 or 24vdc to drive a festo solenoid valve. Someone correct me if i'm wrong, if you purchased the 24v soelnoids from first choice, these would allow you to run them from either 12v or 24v supply.

Note that you will need to purchase two per double solenoid valve.

The 24v solenoids won't work on 12v. I helped a rookie team chase down why their pneumatics wouldn't work a couple of years ago. It was a frustrating pain and we tried everything until we realized that it was a 24v solenoid.

[MrBasse]

Originally Posted by nuttle

I don't think this part works this way, but the documentation I've come across isn't 100% clear on this point. My reading of things is this particular part can work with either 12 or 24V valves, but only when the applied voltage matches the specifications of the valve. There are both 12 and 24V valves in the same family that can be used with this part. In other words, this part is more like a connector and does not regulate the voltage or anything like this. I think you're stuck using valves that take the same voltage, using two pneumatics modules in your cRIO, or using a Spike for 12V and a pneumatics module for 24V. Not only would putting a voltage regulator in-line violate the rules (from past years), but this would also likely not work, at least not very well. Maybe a resistor could be used, but this would likely run into the same issues, at least with the rules.

Bottom line: I would check very carefully before trying this, particularly given the costs involved if testing destroyed a valve or one were to go bad at an event.

This is correct. Those are simply connectors and do nothing to regulate voltage. They can be used for either 12v or 24v, but will not make the solenoid work with either voltage.