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#16
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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#17
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Re: Definition of A Catch
Since there is another complete action (possession by the original robot after a TRUSS score) I do not think that really is "directly preceded by the truss score.
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#18
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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But I agree this is definitely a grey area and a question for Q and A |
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#19
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Re: Definition of A Catch
Here's how I interpreted the rulings here:
It is only possible to score one truss score per cycle, and since you have to get a truss score immediately before a catch, you can only catch once per cycle. As I understand it, you simply must throw the ball over the truss and have an alliance member's robot catch it. Catching would probably entail having a part specifically designed to gain control of the ball, and I highly doubt that judges will consider bouncing a ball off of a plate to be "catching" (and all of their calls cannot be contested). I do feel confident in my understanding, because our team spends the first four hours of the first day reading completely through the rules, then asking each other for their interpretations on vague rules. I would recommend every team at least make all their members read the rules once, so that they can have some ideas of restrictions they have on their robot and strategy. |
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#20
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Re: Definition of A Catch
Simplified "once per cycle" for catch points is to prevent an alliance playing lacrosse over the truss.
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#21
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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A CATCH occurs when a BALL SCORED over the TRUSS by a ROBOT’S ALLIANCE partner is POSSESSED by that ROBOT before contacting the carpet or HUMAN PLAYER. Possessing is also very clearly defined. POSSESS: (for a ROBOT) to carry (move while supporting BALLS in or on the ROBOT), herd (repeated pushing or bumping), launch (impel BALLS to a desired location or direction), or trap (overt isolation or holding one or more BALLS against a FIELD element or ROBOT in an attempt to shield them) a BALL. I don't doubt that a QA will clarify these things and you may end up being right and interpreted it the way that had meant. However as written, I do not think that is the case. |
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#22
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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Nope. Doesnt seem like deflecting a ball at a desired location is possesion to me. |
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#23
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Re: Definition of A Catch
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Do you want to count your own ball falling on your robot and bouncing off in the direction of your ramp as a possession? Then you also have to accept that if one of the opponent's balls happens to fall on your robot, and it bounces off in the direction of your ramp, that you have possessed their ball and are guilty of a technical foul. |
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#24
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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#25
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Re: Definition of A Catch
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#26
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Re: Definition of A Catch
I really doesn't matter what you think. It matters what the refs decide at competition. My post is still correct, as the rules state, controlled direction of the ball is a catch. However I'm pretty sure that either the GDC or refs will change the rule or it's interpretation as soon as someone tries it. I'm betting that they will rule impelling the ball via an angled sheet is not a catch, so I wouldn't put any time into trying that as a strategy since it will become useless after week 1.
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#27
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Re: Definition of A Catch
I don't understand how this didn't end the debate.
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#28
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Re: Definition of A Catch
The reason is that there is still grey area as to what is a "deflection" and what is a "launch". According to the manual,
deflecting = being hit by a propelled BALL that bounces or rolls off the ROBOT launch = impel BALLS to a desired location or direction Here are a few examples (note that "hit" in this context denotes some sort of active interaction and "bounce" denotes inactive interaction): 1. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot which proceeds to hit the moving ball right into the low goal. 2. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot which proceeds to hit the moving ball into a high goal (much larger opening). Although the specific location is not consistent, it still consistently hits somewhere in the high goal. 3. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot which proceeds to hit the ball to the ground next to a teammate robot a few feet away. 4. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot which proceeds to hit the ball forward relative to the robot. Although there is no specific "location" that the ball goes, the "direction" is consistently forward. 5. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot and then bounces on the top of my robot into the high goal. 6. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot and then bounces (possibly with the help of an angled top) off the top of my robot to the ground directly in front of an alliance partner. 7. A ball scored over the truss comes out of the air to my robot and then bounces off of my robot in an arbitrary direction. It should hopefully be pretty clear to everyone that (1) is a launch and that (7) is a deflection. But the question still remains: where is the line drawn between them? |
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#29
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Re: Definition of A Catch
How can a bounce possibly be a catch?
The definition of Catch (according to section 3.1.4 of the Game Manual) includes Possession. Possession is defined in 3.2.3.4, and includes Launching but not Bouncing. Launching is further defined in that section to be impelling (which is the same as propelling). There is a clear distinction between Launching (impelling) and Bouncing: Launching adds kinetic energy to the ball, Bouncing merely redirects it. Note that if a bounced balls goes in a desired direction, whether by luck or design), that does not make it a Possession. A single bounce off a robot is not a catch. If you disagree, please quote a rule to justify your position. |
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#30
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Re: Definition of A Catch
Driving forward while hitting the ball is adding kinetic energy to the ball. The issue here is that we don't have a clear definition for what "impelling" means in the terms of frc.
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