Go to Post "Please, please, please? Pretty please? I'll get you Mountain Dew..." - Karibou [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > FIRST > General Forum
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #16   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 08:16
rees2001 rees2001 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Rees
FRC #0340 (Greater Rochester Robotics)
Team Role: Teacher
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Rookie Year: 2000
Location: Rochester NY
Posts: 802
rees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond reputerees2001 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Being one move ahead of your opponent rather than one move behind them. If you are reacting to what the other team is doing you have already fallen behind. Scouting will be paramount. Knowing the strengths and weaknesses of the teams you are playing and the strengths and weaknesses of you alliance will make the difference between a W or an L.

The communication behind the glass will be a killer. Staying undefeated will be really hard this year. teams can easily be taken down by their own alliance.

(not so hypothetical strategy)

Team A
"teams A & B will shoot in auto. We will do a 2 ball auto, team C just drive forward"

Team C
"but we need to show our auto mode for elims!"

Team B
"Our scouts say you haven't hit it once."

Team C
"that's why we need to show we can do it!"

Team A
"did you get it on the practice field?"

Team C
"no we couldn't get a time, but our programmers say they fixed the problem"


The best possible solution is A&B let C shoot and then ....
Reply With Quote
  #17   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 09:00
IndySam's Avatar
IndySam IndySam is offline
Registered User
FRC #0829 (Digital Goats)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Indy
Posts: 3,362
IndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Assists are going to be much harder to do than people think.

Too many teams will concentrate their designs on shooting the ball through the goal (not that difficult of a task) and not on making nice easy to pick up passes.
__________________
"Champions are champions not because they do anything extraordinary but because they do the ordinary things better than anyone else." —Chuck Knoll


2015 Indianapolis District Winner
2014 Boilermaker Regional Industrial Design Award
2013 Smoky Mountain Regional Industrial Design Award
2012 Boilermaker Engineering Excellence Award
2010 Boilermaker Rockwell Innovation in Control Award.
2009 Buckeye J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2009 Boilermaker J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2008 Boilermaker J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2007 St Louis Regional Winners
Reply With Quote
  #18   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 09:43
pfreivald's Avatar
pfreivald pfreivald is offline
Registered User
AKA: Patrick Freivald
FRC #1551 (The Grapes of Wrath)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Naples, NY
Posts: 2,303
pfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond reputepfreivald has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Contact inside the frame perimeter can be a serious problem when you're trying to acquire a ball and your opponent is playing defense on you.
__________________
Patrick Freivald -- Mentor
Team 1551
"The Grapes of Wrath"
Bausch & Lomb, PTC Corporation, and Naples High School

I write books, too!
Reply With Quote
  #19   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 10:57
E Dawg E Dawg is offline
... is not done with FRC yet.
AKA: Ethan
FRC #0159 (Alpine Robotics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 267
E Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud ofE Dawg has much to be proud of
Re: What could go wrong?

Moving in autonomous.

I know that may sound silly since all the robot has to do is move forward, but based on past years I've seen lots of situations were teams failed to move their robot in autonomous.
Reply With Quote
  #20   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 11:10
BrendanB BrendanB is offline
Registered User
AKA: Brendan Browne
FRC #1058 (PVC Pirates)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Londonderry, NH
Posts: 3,104
BrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond reputeBrendanB has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Acquiring a ball, assists, and drive practice. These would be my top unprepared items most teams will fail at or are underestimating.

Acquiring and keeping control of the ball/game piece is a huge aspect most teams underestimate year after year. Most teams spend most of their match trying to gain control of the game piece or lose it easily.

Assists are this year's big ticket item for points but most teams will underestimate what is needed to do assists well. Simply saying in a strategy meeting, "we'll simply just spit the ball out and they will give it back to us" will not get you very far. There are so many factors that will go into working well will your partners on the field. I predict that most alliances will attempt to do a triple assist (or even double) and spend their entire match trying to do it but running out of time to score.

All of this boils down to drive practice. You NEED to give your drivers time to practice its not even funny. There is no end game where you can make up the difference you have one part of the game and you need to some part of it well. This all comes down to your drivers. You can design a robot that does everything but if your driver can't perform to the level your robot needs to be driven at you are going to have a bad time. Assisting will but a huge time dump if drivers aren't ready to do it quickly. I see a lot of matches being won by a robot out cycling a few poor robots attempting to assist.
__________________
1519 Mechanical M.A.Y.H.E.M. 2008 - 2010
3467 Windham Windup 2011 - 2015
1058 PVC Pirates 2016 - xxxx
Reply With Quote
  #21   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 11:46
Kevin Ray's Avatar
Kevin Ray Kevin Ray is offline
Registered User
None #0329 (Raiders)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Rookie Year: 2000
Location: Medford, NY
Posts: 227
Kevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to beholdKevin Ray is a splendid one to behold
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko Ed View Post
It won't be a robot issue.
It'll be a communication and strategy issue with their partners.
It's hard to get people on the same page in a ten minute period.
Ed you hit it right on the head. All the issues previously discussed in other threads have detailed strategy concerns, but I bears repeating here. ONE playing piece for three teams and the miriad of permutations as to what each of the allies could be doing at a given time relative to each other and the other alliance is very fluid and difficult to coreograph--even if they were willing to do it, forget about just trying to convey all that info.
__________________
_____________________________________________

Last words before magic smoke appears: "There, that oughta work!"
2016 Utah Regional- Engineering Inspiration
2016 Utah Regional- Dean's List Semi-Finalist- Ed O'Connor
2016 Utah Regional- Dean's List Semi-Finalist- Emily Ferrari
2016 Utah Regional- 3rd seed
2016 SBPLI Regional- Finalist, 6th seed
2016 SBPLI Regional- Gracious Professionalism Award
Reply With Quote
  #22   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 11:59
BigJ BigJ is online now
Registered User
AKA: Josh P.
FRC #1675 (Ultimate Protection Squad)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 947
BigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond reputeBigJ has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

I think a lot of teams will practice and practice and practice...

and then realize they don't know what they should be doing when not holding the ball.
Reply With Quote
  #23   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 12:19
jwfoss jwfoss is offline
Chasing Elegant Simplicity
AKA: Justin Foss
FRC #0558 (Elm City Robo Squad)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: New Haven, CT
Posts: 592
jwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond reputejwfoss has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Lawrence View Post
"We need you to play defence."
"But we need assists!"
"We can make up the difference."
"But we need assists!"
"You guys are far more valuable as a defender"
"But we need assists!"
"You cause more penalties than you score points."




"But we need assists!"


Can't wait for these conversations...


-Nick
Like most years, I also expect a lot of this one: "But we need to show that we can _______ this match"
__________________
2003-2006 | FRC 0176 | Aces High - Student
2007-2010 | FRC 0229 | Division by Zero - Mentor in Training
2011-2013 | FRC 2168 | Aluminum Falcons - Mechanical Mentor
2013-20xx | FRC 0558 | Elm City Robo Squad - Mechanical Mentor
Reply With Quote
  #24   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 12:29
bduddy bduddy is offline
Registered User
FRC #0840 (ART)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: San Bruno, CA
Posts: 869
bduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond reputebduddy has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Too many teams will waste too much time trying to acquire the ball, just like always.
__________________

Does anyone else remember when TBA signatures actually worked?
Reply With Quote
  #25   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 12:33
Taylor's Avatar
Taylor Taylor is offline
Professor of Thinkology, ThD
AKA: @taylorstem
FRC #3487 (Red Pride Robotics)
Team Role: Teacher
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA 46227
Posts: 4,604
Taylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond reputeTaylor has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfreivald View Post
Contact inside the frame perimeter can be a serious problem when you're trying to acquire a ball and your opponent is playing defense on you.
QFT. There will be a LOT of incidental, unintentinal incursions, especially Week 1. I wouldn't be surprised to see an Update come out between Week 1&2 of competition season reminding teams to be aware of their design.
__________________
Hi!
Reply With Quote
  #26   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 13:01
KVillie's Avatar
KVillie KVillie is offline
Graphic Designer
AKA: Kevin
FRC #4587 (Jersey Voltage)
Team Role: Student
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2
KVillie is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brycen66 View Post
Defense. Unprepared teams can get completely shut down if they are up against a solid defense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJ View Post
I think a lot of teams will practice and practice and practice...

and then realize they don't know what they should be doing when not holding the ball.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko Ed View Post
It won't be a robot issue.
It'll be a communication and strategy issue with their partners.
It's hard to get people on the same page in a ten minute period.
These three imho are going to be the biggies. Last year all we really had to do was make fast cycles and occasionally maneuver around a defensive bot. This year, a single robot will only have the ball (ideally) about one-third of the time, leaving the other two available to play defense or get set up to receive assists. If you have robots that are entirely focused on being able to do nothing but put the ball in the goal, you're not going to be able to form any kind of strategy at all.

This year, all the robots on the alliance should be able to play some kind of defense for when they don't control the ball. There aren't any no-touch zones on the field this year, so it's possible to totally shut down an alliance's progress by just physically keeping them from moving down the field. Coordinating a strategy that actually involves as much if not more defense than offense is going to determine who goes to nationals and who doesn't.
Reply With Quote
  #27   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 13:03
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 10,798
Al Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

I am surprised no one wrote anything about inspections. You can't play if you don't have the sticker! Number one on my list is legal bumpers, followed by legal pneumatics and electrics. This year add successful dry fire tests so scary shooters don't launch objects (robot parts) into the spectator seating areas. Be safe out there....
__________________
Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
________________________
Storming the Tower since 1996.
Reply With Quote
  #28   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 13:36
mathking's Avatar
mathking mathking is offline
Coach/Faculty Advisor
AKA: Greg King
FRC #1014 (Dublin Robotics aka "Bad Robots")
Team Role: Teacher
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 1999
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 642
mathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond reputemathking has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfreivald View Post
Contact inside the frame perimeter can be a serious problem when you're trying to acquire a ball and your opponent is playing defense on you.
Good observation. This is going to be a real problem for some teams. I also think that many teams are going to struggle with their own shooter damaging the robot. I see a lot of catapults causing repeated stress damage to the robots on which they are deployed.
__________________
Thank you Bad Robots for giving me the chance to coach this team.
Rookie All-Star Award: 2003 Buckeye
Engineering Inspiration Award: 2004 Pittsburgh, 2014 Crossroads
Chairman's Award: 2005 Pittsburgh, 2009 Buckeye, 2012 Queen City
Team Spirit Award: 2007 Buckeye, 2015 Queen City
Woodie Flowers Award: 2009 Buckeye
Dean's List Finalists: Phil Aufdencamp (2010), Lindsey Fox (2011), Kyle Torrico (2011), Alix Bernier (2013), Deepthi Thumuluri (2015)
Gracious Professionalism Award: 2013 Buckeye
Innovation in Controls Award: 2015 Pittsburgh
Event Finalists: 2012 CORI, 2016 Buckeye

Last edited by mathking : 14-01-2014 at 13:39.
Reply With Quote
  #29   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 13:45
Caleb Sykes's Avatar
Caleb Sykes Caleb Sykes is offline
Registered User
FRC #4536 (MinuteBots)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 1,062
Caleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond reputeCaleb Sykes has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What could go wrong?

There will be at least one team that does not understand the 20" extension rules and unintentionally breaks them for their catching mechanism. For example, a 28"x28" robot will try to extend into a 68"x68"square by extending out ~28" from each of the 4 corners. Read G24! It shows rounded corners for the legal extension area.
Reply With Quote
  #30   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 14-01-2014, 13:46
pntbll1313's Avatar
pntbll1313 pntbll1313 is offline
2052 Coach, Build/Electrical Mentor
AKA: Pete
FRC #2052 (KnightKrawler)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: New Brighton, MN
Posts: 254
pntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud ofpntbll1313 has much to be proud of
Re: What could go wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfreivald View Post
Contact inside the frame perimeter can be a serious problem when you're trying to acquire a ball and your opponent is playing defense on you.
Great point! I think there will be quite a few claw type grabbers going after the ball, and quite a few net-type catchers that may try to defend. When these 2 meet it may be hard to separate them...
__________________
2016 (mentor/drive-coach)
Quarter-Finalist-Einstein, Winner-Carson Division Champs, Winner-10K Lakes, Chairman's Award-10K Lakes, Finalists-Lake Superior,
Winner-MSHSL Robotics Competition

2015 (mentor/drive-coach)
Finalists-10K Lakes, Finalists-Lake Superior, Finalist-MSHL Robotics Competition, Quarter-Finalist-Galileo Division Champs
2014 (mentor/drive-coach)
Winner-10K Lakes, Winner-Lake Superior Winner-MSHSL Robotics Competition, Quarter-Finalist-Galileo Division Champs
2013 (mentor/drive-coach)
Winner-10K Lakes, Winner-Lake Superior, Winner-MSHSL Robotics Competition, Quarter-Finalist-Newton Division Champs
2012 (mentor/drive-coach)
Finalists-Lake Superior, Semi-Finalist-MSHSL State Championship, Semi-Finalists at 10,000 Lakes
2008-2011 (college mentor)
2007 (driver)
Quarter Finalist-Milwaukee
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 15:16.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi