Thoughts on the new AM14U 2014 KOP Drive train?

[cgmv123]

Originally Posted by SargeUSMC

Does anyone have a drawing of the side rails with dimensions at all? Specifically the dimensions for the center area where the drive hardware bolts up. I'm trying to determine what modifications may be needed for the 2 CIM ball shifters we bought.

You can always measure the official CAD models.

[SargeUSMC]

Originally Posted by cgmv123

You can always measure the official CAD models.

Thanks Max. I saw that on their site. I was hoping to land a pdf so I could play with this at home here, but I'll take all the help I can get. I do appreciate it. I can't manipulate it myself here, but I'm sure I can get it done at school.

If anyone has a pdf drawing with those center dimensions to share, that'd be great.

Thanks again.

SEMPER FI

[GUI]

The pages for the individual plates have layout drawings.

Inner Plate: http://files.andymark.com/am-2567%20...-%20Folded.PDF
Outer Plate: http://files.andymark.com/AM-2572%20Outer%20Plate.PDF

[SargeUSMC]

Originally Posted by GUI

The pages for the individual plates have layout drawings.

Inner Plate: http://files.andymark.com/am-2567%20...-%20Folded.PDF
Outer Plate: http://files.andymark.com/AM-2572%20Outer%20Plate.PDF

AHA! Those I didn't see!

I looked at the diagram for the inner plate and unfortunately there aren't any dimensions in the center there except for the larger holes. I'll have to see what I can get from the .step.

Thanks loads for your help, Gary.

[Dad1279]

We did this today. Used a bearing to locate with the transmission sideplate and a transfer punch to mark the 4 mounting holes. You may need to slot the upper hole as shown for the shaft.

Check the gearing for your application.

[SargeUSMC]

Thank you kindly sir. Puts me in the ballpark. 'preciate it.

Semper Fi.

[styxracer97]

My team is actually designing a custom chassis based off of the KOP one, it is very nice option in my opinion.

[Oblarg]

So, after working with this thing for a while, here's some more developed feedback:

1) Direct-drive center wheel is fantastic, and I like how easy it is to mount nonstandard gearboxes.

2) The sheet-metal construction is nice, but would benefit from more rigidity - even with the stiffeners it's more wobbly than I'd like.

3) There is absolutely no good reason for the outer plate to be set lower than the inner - all this does is make mounting things harder. Mounting to the frame is, in general, easier than in previous years but still a pain.

4) Having to remove the outer plates to do any reasonable drive maintenance is horrible. Serviceability is one of the core design features of any good FRC drive, and servicing the AM14U looks to be a real pain. Time will tell if it becomes a problem at regionals.

5) There should have been holes pre-drilled for construction in alternate frame dimensions - it's a lot more effort this year than in previous years. The lengthwise plates are the cause of most of the issues; having to make that weird angle cut, and additionally hacksaw off a portion of the flange is really annoying, and it's compounded if you're not going 23x32 and thus need to drill a whole bunch of new holes as well (which could easily have been pre-drilled without compromising structural integrity)

6) Belt tension is very good compared to last year, but still seems a little loose on all three of the AM14U's I've seen.

Final note: Churro stock is probably my favorite new AndyMark product over the past two years. I absolutely adore it.

[Rynocorn]

Originally Posted by Oblarg

Final note: Churro stock is probably my favorite new AndyMark product over the past two years. I absolutely adore it.

Seconded- we are using a modified kitbot chassis and we might have 34 total pieces of churro for support in the drivetrain... We shouldn't bend or break at all I hope

[AllenGregoryIV]

Originally Posted by Rynocorn

Seconded- we are using a modified kitbot chassis and we might have 34 total pieces of churro for support in the drivetrain... We shouldn't bend or break at all I hope

Have you considered just putting pieces of lumber like 2x4s between the rails? Some very well known teams (1114 in 2008 I believe) have done this in the past and it makes for a very rigid system.

[Alan Anderson]

Originally Posted by Oblarg

4) Having to remove the outer plates to do any reasonable drive maintenance is horrible. Serviceability is one of the core design features of any good FRC drive, and servicing the AM14U looks to be a real pain. Time will tell if it becomes a problem at regionals.

A couple of our students have gotten really good at removing and replacing those. If you have a good electric nutdriver, it's not really a big problem. The only issue I see on our team's robot is all the stuff that somehow has ended up mounted to the side plates' flanges.

[Oblarg]

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson

A couple of our students have gotten really good at removing and replacing those. If you have a good electric nutdriver, it's not really a big problem. The only issue I see on our team's robot is all the stuff that somehow has ended up mounted to the side plates' flanges.

We attempted a "do not mount anything to the outer plates" rule, but quickly abandoned it when it became clear that there was absolutely no other feasible way to get our roller arm on our robot (it was still hard, though, because the outer flange is inexplicably not at the same height as the inner one). It's thankfully not all that difficult to remove with our current design, but it's still a pain.

Even with an electric nutdriver, it's not something I want to be doing between matches. You should not need to remove a critical structural element of your chassis to get access to the belts or the center wheel. I hope they change this next year.

[Rynocorn]

Originally Posted by AllenGregoryIV

Have you considered just putting pieces of lumber like 2x4s between the rails? Some very well known teams (1114 in 2008 I believe) have done this in the past and it makes for a very rigid system.

Yeah we were going to try it but our electronics and pneumatics are all packed down in there and the respective captains didn't really support my motion to put large pieces of wood through the middle