Go to Post If only CD had a "like" button. - BrendanB [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Technical > Pneumatics
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-02-2014, 17:08
jvriezen jvriezen is offline
Registered User
FRC #3184 (Burnsville Blaze)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Burnsville, MN
Posts: 636
jvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond reputejvriezen has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesCH95 View Post
Epoxy wouldn't work?
As an Inspector, the soldering would definitely raise questions, and Epoxy would probably make me call the LRI (if I noticed it). I don't know enough about the possible chemical reactions between whatever form of epoxy used and brass to know if there is risk of compromise.
__________________
John Vriezen
FRC, Mentor, Inspector #3184 2016- #4859 2015, #2530 2010-2014 FTC Mentor, Inspector #7152 2013-14
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-02-2014, 17:46
DonRotolo's Avatar
DonRotolo DonRotolo is offline
Back to humble
FRC #0832
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Atlanta GA
Posts: 6,998
DonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond reputeDonRotolo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

I'd also flunk that, also with epoxy.
__________________

I am N2IRZ - What's your callsign?
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-02-2014, 18:00
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 10,770
Al Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

You may not modify pneumatic parts. A famous vendor from Kokomo was reminded of that at Champs two years ago.
__________________
Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
________________________
Storming the Tower since 1996.
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-02-2014, 19:32
IndySam's Avatar
IndySam IndySam is offline
Registered User
FRC #0829 (Digital Goats)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Indy
Posts: 3,355
IndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond reputeIndySam has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz View Post
You may not modify pneumatic parts. A famous vendor from Kokomo was reminded of that at Champs two years ago.
After I warned him!
__________________
"Champions are champions not because they do anything extraordinary but because they do the ordinary things better than anyone else." —Chuck Knoll


2015 Indianapolis District Winner
2014 Boilermaker Regional Industrial Design Award
2013 Smoky Mountain Regional Industrial Design Award
2012 Boilermaker Engineering Excellence Award
2010 Boilermaker Rockwell Innovation in Control Award.
2009 Buckeye J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2009 Boilermaker J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2008 Boilermaker J&J Gracious Professionalism Award
2007 St Louis Regional Winners
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 05-02-2014, 19:57
JamesCH95's Avatar
JamesCH95 JamesCH95 is offline
Hardcore Dork
AKA: JCH
FRC #0095 (The Grasshoppers)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Enfield, NH
Posts: 1,832
JamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonRotolo View Post
I'd also flunk that, also with epoxy.
Why would you flunk a fitting that has been glued in place?

Would VHB or a double-stick tape be okay in your opinion?
__________________
Theory is a nice place, I'd like to go there one day, I hear everything works there.

Maturity is knowing you were an idiot, common sense is trying to not be an idiot, wisdom is knowing that you will still be an idiot.
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-02-2014, 13:57
Tristan Lall's Avatar
Tristan Lall Tristan Lall is offline
Registered User
FRC #0188 (Woburn Robotics)
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Rookie Year: 1999
Location: Toronto, ON
Posts: 2,484
Tristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesCH95 View Post
Why would you flunk a fitting that has been glued in place?

Would VHB or a double-stick tape be okay in your opinion?
It's the usual problem of whether adhesive fastening should be considered a violation of the rule that "[a]ll pneumatic COMPONENTS must be used in their original, unaltered condition" (with exceptions).

Given that adhesion is inherently an interaction between surfaces that (on an atomic level) leaves neither unchanged, there's a case to be made that every adhesion is an alteration. On the other hand, plenty of other things (like simple contact) involve changes at that level, and wouldn't conventionally be called alterations.

FIRST would probably be concerned with the use of solvent-based adhesives on polymer substrates (high risk of error leading to failure, e.g. of a crazed pneumatic tank), or of installations that impose unforeseen loads (e.g. using epoxy to mechanically fasten a dynamic component to the side of a pneumatic cylinder). They probably wouldn't be concerned about masking tape holding a pneumatic tube out of the way, or about normal wear and tear incurred during a short working life. But the rules don't offer a specific basis upon which to distinguish these cases, so absent clarification from the usual official sources, it's going to come down to the officials at each event and their interpretation of the rule.

I think it will be hard to set and enforce a consistent standard using the rule as written, because alteration is easy to find if you're looking. If that's true, a rule update (possibly in the form of some more exceptions) would be preferable to a Q&A response (which can't change the fundamental constraint concerning the "original, unaltered condition").
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-02-2014, 14:09
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 10,770
Al Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: solder a bracket to a brass pneumatic fitting?

Tristan, I am relating the standard rubric that inspectors are trained to make decisions in the field based on the rule and the inspection checklist.

____ No Modifications - pneumatic parts may not be modified except actuator mounting pins may be removed. <R76>
__________________
Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
________________________
Storming the Tower since 1996.
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 17:09.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi