Week 1 Analysis

[mwtidd]

Originally Posted by JesseK

I haven't been able to watch a single match due to my day job. But after reading this entire thread, it really seems like typical Week 1 jitters.

Except for that anti-scoring device behind the goal. That really should be fixed. We spend thousands of dollars per year as an organization on FIRST's partners and I'm sure one of them can sponsor a fix.

The fix was estimated even before week zero. I heard that given the number of fields it was estimated at over $60k. Where I totally agree something needs to be done, I also understand FIRST waiting to see how big of an issue it really was. However after week zero, and one day of qualifications, I think they have their answer.

[Christopher149]

- A beautifully flowing match (for at least 1 alliance) is such a rarity, but it wins matches by a landslide.
- Assist!
- Balls left over from auto are sometimes never scored, and this makes the audience cringe and makes you (probably ) lose the match.
- Assists plus a fast 1-pointer are better than assist plus a slow/repeated-because-of-misses 10-pointer.
- I hope elims has filtered us down to the competent, so that a match might be a bit more exciting/high scoring.
- There have been matches where a single bot that can 10-point and knows what it is doing can win a match (no assists).

[Wayne TenBrink]

Is there a way to identify the "un-penalized" score for a match? Does the cumulative "TELEOP" score in the Team Standings on the FIRST website include penalties?

[mwtidd]

Originally Posted by Wayne TenBrink

Is there a way to identify the "un-penalized" score for a match? Does the cumulative "TELEOP" score in the Team Standings on the FIRST website include penalties?

Teleop + Autonomous (hybrid) in the twitter feed.
FRCFMS

For example RTS +RHS = Red points scored

[Kevin Kolodziej]

One thing I noticed that I dont understand at all is why the truss at the Southfield district does not have the vertical posts in line with the field boundary. I've seen at least two TRUSS scores be denied by the ball hitting those posts and bouncing backwards at other events. Why are MI teams playing on an altered field??

[Basel A]

Originally Posted by Wayne TenBrink

Is there a way to identify the "un-penalized" score for a match? Does the cumulative "TELEOP" score in the Team Standings on the FIRST website include penalties?

Short answers: Yes. Yes.

Break down the ways to score into Fouls, Auto, Assist, T&C, and Balls. From the FRC FMS, you have FP (Fouls), HS (Auto), and TS (Assist+T&C+Ball), so you can get unpenalised score from there. In the Standings, you have Assist, Auto, T&C and Teleop. Teleop includes every way to score not previously mentioned, so Teleop = Balls + Fouls. I've done basic comparisons between FMS and Standings pages, this analysis checks out.

[kenavt]

Originally Posted by Kevin Kolodziej

One thing I noticed that I dont understand at all is why the truss at the Southfield district does not have the vertical posts in line with the field boundary. I've seen at least two TRUSS scores be denied by the ball hitting those posts and bouncing backwards at other events. Why are MI teams playing on an altered field??

I was told that the FTA said that during the driver's meeting, Southfield didn't receive them in their shipment from Manchester.

[Donut]

Originally Posted by Michael Hill

It seems like gameplay here at Central illinois has been much more violent than in years past. Teams realized when they don't have the ball, you double team on defense until you're open. I hope everyone built a physically strong robot.

This. I expected a physical game, but wow, this reminds me of the years before bumpers.

I am surprised by the scores this early in the season. Teams are figuring out how to Truss + 2 Assist or to 3 Assist pretty quickly considering it's not even Saturday yet. I haven't seen a ton of matches today at CIR but it seemed like a good bot running single cycles was only effective very early in the day.

[Alex Cormier]

Originally Posted by pwnageNick

The balls bouncing out of the goals and some assists not being counted have to be the 2 biggest things out there so far. I have especially noticed that the assists that are left out most often are the third one of a cycle, at least it seemed to be the most prevalent.

The last team needs to be entirely in a zone, if the robot is straddling between zones, it affects the assists.

[PVCpirate]

This might be unpopular, but I don't think the bar behind the goal should be changed. When I first saw people posting about it, I pulled up the official drawings and found the part. If I was on a team, there's a decent chance I would have wanted to see exactly how the goal would look at competition, and at least try to adjust my shots accordingly. The rules also state that the ball must go through the goal and stay there to be scored. It's the same bar for everyone, and it was never a secret.

[Racer26]

Originally Posted by lineskier

The fix was estimated even before week zero. I heard that given the number of fields it was estimated at over $60k. Where I totally agree something needs to be done, I also understand FIRST waiting to see how big of an issue it really was. However after week zero, and one day of qualifications, I think they have their answer.

There are around 20 fields. I find it hard to believe FIRST couldnt find a solution under 3k/field.

[indubitably]

I personally think this game will evolve well in the coming weeks. It is frustrating when there are issues early on that seem obvious to predict but they will most likely correct it enough to make it competitive in the coming weeks.

Unlike most people apparently, I have seen a decent amount of close games and they get very intense. Yes, endgames have some inherent excitement, but seeing frantic strategies develop to score quick points is something that seemed rare in close games in the past.

There was a pretty crazy ending at Central Illinois where the match was tied and both alliances inbounded their balls around the 7 sec mark. Red launched the truss shot first, got the 10 pts, and then the red ball collided with the blue ball on the other side of the truss, preventing blue from tying it up again.

[PVCpirate]

Originally Posted by indubitably

I personally think this game will evolve well in the coming weeks. It is frustrating when there are issues early on that seem obvious to predict but they will most likely correct it enough to make it competitive in the coming weeks.

Unlike most people apparently, I have seen a decent amount of close games and they get very intense. Yes, endgames have some inherent excitement, but seeing frantic strategies develop to score quick points is something that seemed rare in close games in the past.

There was a pretty crazy ending at Central Illinois where the match was tied and both alliances inbounded their balls around the 7 sec mark. Red launched the truss shot first, got the 10 pts, and then the red ball collided with the blue ball on the other side of the truss, preventing blue from tying it up again.

I saw some close matches, Palmetto was usually pretty competitive, there was a nice buzzer-beater shot and a couple times where an alliance needed one last shot but couldn't score it. I think elims tomorrow will be fun

[tkell274]

I agree with everyone else here that the issues of the balls bouncing out and the refs not catching all the assists and fouls is a big problem. With that said you need to have someone paying attention to the whole match so in case you lose for a reason you shouldn't have you can go and discuss it with the head ref.

Another pet peeve of mine for this year is seeing alliances playing matches with only two robots. This is totally unacceptable in my opinion. In past years you could get away with this because all you needed was one strong robot to win it. But now with the addition of assist points the third team is very vital which is why I believe that unless your robot is totally disabled and not even able to move, you HAVE to get your robot out to the field to help play defense and help in the assist process. Obviously this will not be such an issue come later weeks but to not go out for a qualification match at all just irritates me.

[Michael Corsetto]

One question: Should referee scoring stations be positioned here, like in this image? http://i.imgur.com/Ufs5xZFl.jpg It honestly gets in the way of the Human Player.

This game is hard to play well. Given that powerhouses aren't setting the high scores, it's anyone's game IMO.

We'll see what inland looks like tomorrow. If you want a good webcast, check out citruscircuits.org/live Full HD, full field video! Hope you all like it!

-Mike