Go to Post I love it when there is someone that obviously "gets it". - dlavery [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Competition > Rules/Strategy
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Closed Thread
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 2 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 20:50
nlj007 nlj007 is offline
Registered User
FRC #0900
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Durham
Posts: 30
nlj007 has a spectacular aura aboutnlj007 has a spectacular aura about
Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

I was ecstatic to see how effective team 900's truss shot to the human player was at the South Carolina regional was. I put together a video showcasing the shot. I truly believe this will be a very effective strategy at our next competition.

SECRET SAUCE:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjSUAmLFnwY
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 21:09
cjl2625's Avatar
cjl2625 cjl2625 is offline
apel py
AKA: Cory Lynch
FRC #2067 (Apple Pi)
Team Role: Programmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Guilford, CT
Posts: 412
cjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to beholdcjl2625 is a splendid one to behold
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Ooh, that's nice. Trussing right from the end of the field. It looks like it would be hard to defend you if you're between the wall and the low goal like that.
If you can do that consistently, I definitely think that will be useful.

Last edited by cjl2625 : 03-03-2014 at 21:12.
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 21:24
Ginger Power's Avatar
Ginger Power Ginger Power is online now
The GreenHorns Team Lead
AKA: Ryan Swanson
FRC #4607 (C.I.S.)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Becker, Minnesota
Posts: 891
Ginger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Please take this thread down they are giving away the secret!!! Joking obviously I really enjoyed watching your robot play. I knew this strategy would be viable. I'm just glad to see it implemented so well.

Last edited by Ginger Power : 03-03-2014 at 21:30.
  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 21:30
Pi3th0n Pi3th0n is offline
Registered User
AKA: Chase Mansell
FRC #0900 (Zebracorns)
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Rookie Year: 2013
Location: Durham
Posts: 21
Pi3th0n is on a distinguished road
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Honestly, the hardest part was convincing our alliance partners that cycle time was more important than points-per-cycle. I didn't feel like our robot was really showing off until Saturday when we were able to get in more than 4 cycles a match.
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 21:44
Ginger Power's Avatar
Ginger Power Ginger Power is online now
The GreenHorns Team Lead
AKA: Ryan Swanson
FRC #4607 (C.I.S.)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Becker, Minnesota
Posts: 891
Ginger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi3th0n View Post
Honestly, the hardest part was convincing our alliance partners that cycle time was more important than points-per-cycle. I didn't feel like our robot was really showing off until Saturday when we were able to get in more than 4 cycles a match.
If you guys or any other robot doing this strategy (I only know of 3 teams doing it including your team) gets paired with the top scorer, 1pt or 10pt doesn't matter, at a regional things will get crazy. You guys can get the ball from the pedestal to human player in under 10 seconds and the top scorer at a regional should be able to get the ball into a goal within 7-10 seconds regardless of defense. This means 21 or 30 pt cycles in under 20 seconds. This equates to between 147 and 210pts in teleop alone. Factor in a max auton and you are looking at almost 300pts in a match. This also allows for the third robot to play counter defense, defense, or if it's compatible with the top scorer it could add a quick 3rd assist but I don't see this happening until elims.
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 22:04
marshall's Avatar
marshall marshall is offline
My pants are louder than yours.
FRC #0900 (The Zebracorns)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,317
marshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginger Power View Post
Please take this thread down they are giving away the secret!!! Joking obviously I really enjoyed watching your robot play. I knew this strategy would be viable. I'm just glad to see it implemented so well.
Well it's not much of a secret anymore. We don't think we'll see a lot of copycats because it is not that easy to design for. Your bot needs to be purpose built to pull this off from what we think. At the very least it takes a custom gearbox and a decent amount of brute force.
  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 22:24
Ginger Power's Avatar
Ginger Power Ginger Power is online now
The GreenHorns Team Lead
AKA: Ryan Swanson
FRC #4607 (C.I.S.)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Becker, Minnesota
Posts: 891
Ginger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by marshall View Post
Well it's not much of a secret anymore. We don't think we'll see a lot of copycats because it is not that easy to design for. Your bot needs to be purpose built to pull this off from what we think. At the very least it takes a custom gearbox and a decent amount of brute force.
I definitely agree it will be very very uncommon and that you have to plan for this from the beginning. You don't necessarily need a custom gearbox (although it would definitely help). We are using a custom made ratcheting winch with 1 cim motor in a toughbox mini. We also have an acme lead screw which loosens our surgical tubing when our winch pulls the catapult down. The lead screw tensions the surgical tubing (allowing for a variable shot) to our desired shot length. We are hoping that at the max tension we are able to emulate your full court assist to the human player.
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 22:48
nlj007 nlj007 is offline
Registered User
FRC #0900
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Durham
Posts: 30
nlj007 has a spectacular aura aboutnlj007 has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginger Power View Post
I definitely agree it will be very very uncommon and that you have to plan for this from the beginning. You don't necessarily need a custom gearbox (although it would definitely help). We are using a custom made ratcheting winch with 1 cim motor in a toughbox mini. We also have an acme lead screw which loosens our surgical tubing when our winch pulls the catapult down. The lead screw tensions the surgical tubing (allowing for a variable shot) to our desired shot length. We are hoping that at the max tension we are able to emulate your full court assist to the human player.

I would like to see this if you get it successfully implemented. Keep us updated on your progress!
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 22:52
Ginger Power's Avatar
Ginger Power Ginger Power is online now
The GreenHorns Team Lead
AKA: Ryan Swanson
FRC #4607 (C.I.S.)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Becker, Minnesota
Posts: 891
Ginger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by nlj007 View Post
I would like to see this if you get it successfully implemented. Keep us updated on your progress!
I'll post a video to this forum when we finalize our practice robot. We have been waiting on a couple of vital parts from Andymark for about a week. When we get it all in it shouldn't take more than a few days to complete.
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 23:12
stefanp stefanp is offline
Registered User
AKA: Stefan Pleava
FRC #4946 (The Alpha Dogs)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 17
stefanp will become famous soon enough
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by marshall View Post
Well it's not much of a secret anymore. We don't think we'll see a lot of copycats because it is not that easy to design for. Your bot needs to be purpose built to pull this off from what we think. At the very least it takes a custom gearbox and a decent amount of brute force.
I think we have the range to make that kind of shot no problem. Maybe for catapults the have to be custom built but wheeled shooters can just up the speed. I'm interested in trying this out at our next regional! Thanks for the idea!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRK8UGR3vpI
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 23:17
goldenglove002 goldenglove002 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Alex Epstein
FRC #1311 (Kell Robotics)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Blacksburg, VA
Posts: 54
goldenglove002 is a jewel in the roughgoldenglove002 is a jewel in the roughgoldenglove002 is a jewel in the rough
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

I wasn't sure about this strategy prior to joining y'alls alliance for elimination, but it works amazingly. I really think some more practice with the human player/alignment stuff and the right alliance partners in St. Louis would have you taking a good look at Einstein. Keep up the good work!
__________________


2011 Peachtree Regional Dean's List Recipient
2011 Peachtree Regional Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers Entrepreneurship Award
2011 Lemelson/MIT InvenTeams Grant
2010 North Carolina Regional Chairmans Award
2010 Peachtree Regional Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers Entrepreneurship Award
2010 SeaWorld Busch Gardens Environmental Excellence Award
2009 Peachtree Regional Chairmans Award
2008 Peachtree Regional Judges Award
  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 03-03-2014, 23:56
Ginger Power's Avatar
Ginger Power Ginger Power is online now
The GreenHorns Team Lead
AKA: Ryan Swanson
FRC #4607 (C.I.S.)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Becker, Minnesota
Posts: 891
Ginger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond reputeGinger Power has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanp View Post
I think we have the range to make that kind of shot no problem. Maybe for catapults the have to be custom built but wheeled shooters can just up the speed. I'm interested in trying this out at our next regional! Thanks for the idea!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRK8UGR3vpI
It looks like you have the power for the shot which is awesome! The only problem I see for you guys when using this strategy at your regional is the low release point. If I'm a defensive robot on the opposing alliance and my scouting tells me that you are full court assisting I'm going to try to block you. The reason my team went with a catapult was that the release point could get close to 5 feet because of the ball rolling off the catapult as it fires. A high release point makes blocking the shot way more difficult if not impossible. If you watch the youtube video, towards the end you can here the human player (or person behind the camera) yell "try to block us!" or something like that. I think you guys can pull this strategy off. You will just need to compensate for the low release point by using counter defense or shooting while moving. Good luck at your regional!
  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 04-03-2014, 00:40
PayneTrain's Avatar
PayneTrain PayneTrain is offline
Q&A Dartboard Detractor
AKA: Lizard King
FRC #0422 (The Meme Tech Pneumatic Devices)
Team Role: Mascot
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: RVA
Posts: 2,259
PayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond reputePayneTrain has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by marshall View Post
Well it's not much of a secret anymore. We don't think we'll see a lot of copycats because it is not that easy to design for. Your bot needs to be purpose built to pull this off from what we think. At the very least it takes a custom gearbox and a decent amount of brute force.
I think your gearbox would be the least dependent part of the strategy; you seem to be using it only to build up stored energy in surgical tubing. What seems to be the real things that are purpose built and difficult to replicate include the height at which the shot exits and the length of the lever arm. Regardless, this is an effective strategy to get through with in qualification rounds, provided you have at least one other alliance partner who has a robot wit ha working drivebase and preferable herding mechanism, and for that partner to have a human player ready to effectively inbound.
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 04-03-2014, 06:28
scaryone's Avatar
scaryone scaryone is offline
Registered User
FRC #0058 (The Riot Crew)
Team Role: Coach
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: South Portland Maine
Posts: 136
scaryone will become famous soon enough
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Very cool bot and interesting strategy. Wondering if risk of foul points factors in? At some of the competitions, fouls for reaching over were an issue. Did you guys find that the case at your event?
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 04-03-2014, 07:48
marshall's Avatar
marshall marshall is offline
My pants are louder than yours.
FRC #0900 (The Zebracorns)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,317
marshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond reputemarshall has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Secret Sauce: Shot to Human Player

Quote:
Originally Posted by scaryone View Post
Very cool bot and interesting strategy. Wondering if risk of foul points factors in? At some of the competitions, fouls for reaching over were an issue. Did you guys find that the case at your event?
Not from our human player. He was well trained not to over reach for the ball and cross the barrier. He was one of the few who walked away with no fouls called on him at the event.

We did get a verbal warning from the head ref because we were attempting to shoot to another team's human player a couple of times and our HP couldn't get the shot aligned properly from the back so the ball went out of play. This was easily fixed though and we are now working on a way to train other team's human players.

Thanks for the compliments folks. We appreciate them.
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 16:12.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi