[FRC Blog] Gracious Professionalism and Coopertition

[ebarker]

Awesome !!

[Christopher149]

I remember a thread about this raising a small amount of stink that "the other alliance used the time-out" or that the time-out was traded. Well, they didn't really, and since Frank likes it, it must be okay.

[sanddrag]

One of the first instances I can remember of this was Team 696 giving a time out to 330 at the 2004 Phoenix finals. 330s driver at the time came to me in tears asking if we could use our timeout for them. How could I say no? Of course we would.

I thought in recent years it has not been allowed because it slows the flow of events. Maybe that's only for consecutive timeouts? I don't remember.

[Seth Mallory]

While giving up your time out to the other alliance happins each year I remember at the Championship when in addition to giving up the time out an alliance gave the needed part that help the other alliance win. AT SVR one year 100 was in the finals and 4 of the other 5 robots had team 100 parts on them.

[DampRobot]

I too thought this was illegal, per the tournament rules. But luckily we've never been in the position of having to ask or having been asked for a timeout like this.

[Francis-134]

It is not illegal to use a timeout for another alliance. You cannot, however, have one alliance use a timeout, then have the other alliance use their timeout (i.e. cascading timeouts).

[EricH]

Not legal: Giving your timeout coupon to another alliance.
Not legal: Calling your timeout either right before or right after the other alliance calls theirs.
Legal: Calling your timeout just because your opponents look like they need more time, and haven't called theirs for whatever reason, including having used it earlier. (You're doing a robot repair: the batteries need more charge. )

[Electronica1]

You could just say your driver happens to need to use the bathroom at the same time the other alliance needs the timeout.

[orangemoore]

Provided that all rules are followed in the timing of when a timeout may be used, I think FIRST would be crazy to not allow for an alliance to take a timeout because it was to help the other alliance.

That being said, all of those teams should be proud of the gracious professionalism that they have showed.

[bduddy]

I'm not saying any team involved did anything wrong or anything like that.
BUT... I'm not entirely sure if I like something like this being put in the FRC blog. Basically, it says that this is something you should do, without providing details as to exactly why. Now, if some robot on the other alliance suffers an unexpected calamity, or breaks because you hit them overly hard in the last match, then I would think that it would be graciously professional to use your timeout for them. But, if their robot just happened to break... well, isn't building a robust and reliable robot part of the game? Should alliances really be expected to give up one of their most important resources to accommodate for their opponents' failure? Maybe it's just me, but I don't think so. We're not expected to handicap ourselves on the field, why does it seem like most expect timeouts to work that way?

I apologize if this post comes off as mean or ungracious or anything like that, but I just think that this becoming essentially expected behavior in all cases is not a good thing.

[Oblarg]

Originally Posted by bduddy

Should alliances really be expected to give up one of their most important resources to accommodate for their opponents' failure?

In short: Yes; and if not "expected," then at least "greatly encouraged." FRC is not just a competition, and the members of the opposing alliance are not simply "opponents." It is a communal engineering challenge, and everyone gets the most out of it when all participants are at their best. It is far more inspiring to see this approach to FIRST than to see an alliance lose their last match because they lacked the time or resources to correct a mechanical failure.

The game on the field is not the end-goal of FIRST; it is a tool for achieving that end-goal.

[Ryan Caldwell]

Originally Posted by DampRobot

I too thought this was illegal, per the tournament rules. But luckily we've never been in the position of having to ask or having been asked for a timeout like this.

Not illegal to see your opponents in need and then suddenly realize that your code needs time to cool down before the next match.

[Grim Tuesday]

Another excellent example of this was the 2010 Philadelphia regional. The alliance of 341/365 called a timeout for us after one of our partner's CRIO decided the second match of the semifinals was the best time to stop working. It allowed us to get them fixed up and we ended up with 7-8 loss due to a penalty. Still the most amazing match I have ever watched, and our team still tells stories about how awesome Miss Daisy and MOE are.