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Unread 10-03-2014, 11:54
Michael Hill's Avatar
Michael Hill Michael Hill is offline
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Re: looking at OPR across events

Quote:
Originally Posted by Navid Shafa View Post
If you haven't looked, how do you know it's bad?



First and most importantly, I would never make a picklist solely off of quantitative metrics, nor would I want to pick teams based on Pit-scouting and my assessment after watching that robot play. A good combination of both is what makes holistic scouting so valuable.

In almost every FIRST game, a high seeded captain is looking for a robot that is a strong offensive robot. This is exactly what OPR could assist you in finding. You could almost always look at a list of the top teams in OPR and pick one of those.

The second pick is not something you'd want to determine by OPR. Often, you are lucky to find a robot that can play offense, especially at small events or districts. Things like Pit-scouting become extremely important. I'd often look for teams with Multi-Cim gearboxes and strong 6WD or 8WD bases and drivers that know how to use them in matches effectively.


I've never done this, nor I would attempt to do so. A team's rank in seeding quite often does not directly correlate with robot performance, there are many factors that impact the tournament rankings. I certainly would not expect OPR to exactly match the seeding. Look back to 2010 and 2012's seeding systems, the seeding was greatly impacted not only by your partners but the opposing alliance. Perhaps if we had an extremely large sample size these kinds of ranking comparisons would become relevant...



This is exactly why I brought up CCWM before. This is still in my opinion accurately determining personal performance considering a mixture of different alliances and compositions. If we notice a distinct amount of parity between OPR and CCWM we know that a team has done more or less of the scoring for their alliance. It can also help narrow out teams that ranked extremely high or low, due to really strong or really poor match schedules. i.e. A team with a large CCWM value is doing the bulk of the scoring in general for their alliance.

Since you haven't taken a look at it yet, here is some information from your event, Central Illinois:

Spoiler for Qualification Rankings:
1 525
2 1736
3 1986
4 1806
5 1756
6 1747
7 171
8 2081
9 167
10 2481
11 967
12 2704
13 2451
14 4256
15 1208
16 4143
17 2039
18 4212
19 3138
20 2022
21 2164
22 1764
23 3352
24 4196
25 3284
26 1091
27 4786
28 292
29 1288
30 1094
31 648
32 2040
33 4213
34 4296
35 4655
36 4330
37 5041
38 1739
39 4329
40 2194


Spoiler for Rank by OPR:
1 525
2 1986
3 1806
4 1756
5 4256
6 1747
7 1736
8 167
9 2081
10 171
11 2451
12 4143
13 967
14 1208
15 2039
16 1288
17 3284
18 292
19 648
20 5041
21 2481
22 4212
23 3138
24 1094
25 2704
26 1764
27 4213
28 2040
29 1091
30 2164
31 3352
32 4330
33 2022
34 4196
35 4655
36 4786
37 2194
38 4329
39 1739
40 4296


Spoiler for Rank By CCWM:
1 1986
2 525
3 1806
4 1747
5 1736
6 1756
7 171
8 2081
9 2481
10 3284
11 2451
12 967
13 167
14 1208
15 4143
16 2704
17 4256
18 2039
19 4213
20 4330
21 3138
22 1091
23 1288
24 3352
25 4212
26 2164
27 2022
28 5041
29 4196
30 1764
31 4786
32 4655
33 1094
34 2040
35 4296
36 292
37 2194
38 4329
39 648
40 1739


They look pretty accurate to me, especially at the upper end. I would say both these do a much better job of ranking robot performance than the seeding wouldn't you?

Since you haven't got a chance to look at OPR for the events or your team, I posted the link earlier, but I made a page for you with data just from Central Illinois here: Central Illinois OPR/CCWM with Filtering. Enjoy!
I'd like to see an OPR justification for why 254 chose 973 and 2135 at CVR. Until then, I'd much rather rely on actual scouting data for real performance evaluation. This game has more facets to it than usual, and there are more ways of scoring points. Previously, points were mostly scored by putting something into a goal. This year, many more things have to be done to get points (and a win). This year is all about choosing compatible robots, not just ones who can put points on the board by themselves. 973 was second to last in OPR at Central Valley, but does that mean that they didn't perform well? Sure, the top teams that can put sick points up are going to bubble to the top, but after about 20-30 teams (overall), it's a big jumble. Isn't it the teams after 20-30 the ones you really care about?
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