Different Types of robots

[safiq10]

Now that week 3 dawns upon us what We have seen many different types of robots[list][*]Kickers[*]Passing and defense only[*]Winch catapults[*]Pnumatic hitters[*] and others

What are your opinions on them. Which is more valuable? Which would you rather have on alliance? Let me know what you think.

We have a passing and defense only robot, because we felt that everyone would try to pass and go for highgoals. That someone wouldnt be specialized for defense.

[MrForbes]

A relatively simple robot that is driven so it actually does passing and good defense is a very valuable robot on an alliance. Getting hold of, and keeping control of the ball is vital, and not many non-shooting robots seem to be able to do it well.

[Brandon Zalinsky]

Jim is right about ball control. We have 16" PVC rings that grab the ball, using 2 1.5" pneumatic cylinders. Our shooter is a linear mechanical punch with 240 lb pulling force, retracted by an original steel cable mechanism. Also, my thoughts on playing defense:

We didn't plan to play much defense at our UNH district event with our mecanum drivetrain. We have a creative auxiliary drive in the works, but it wasn't ready for UNH.
When we got there, we usually took the role of inbounding/truss robot. This required us to play a lot of hard defense. Much to our surprise, our 108 lb mecanum machine managed to defend and shut down alliances with 6-CIM tank driven scoring robots.

TL;DR: You don't need to build a robot built purely for defense to play really good defense.

[Max Boord]

What we have/ can do:
2-20 feet shoot into high goal
Dump into top of low goal
High/ slow speed ground pass from the front or back of the robot.
Shoot a lob shot over the truss

What we want for our 1st pick:
Catching
Shoot up close for 10
Powerfull drivetrain

What we want for our 2nd pick:
60+ inches
Unpushable
Good human player inbounding
Able to "regurgitate" the ball out the opposite side to where they inbound.

Elims stratigy is to tripple asist with truss and catch if possible as fast as possible. When not scoring deffend.

[Joseph Smith]

Originally Posted by safiq10

Now that week 3 dawns upon us what We have seen many different types of robots[list][*]Kickers[*]Passing and defense only[*]Winch catapults[*]Pnumatic hitters[*] and others

What are your opinions on them. Which is more valuable? Which would you rather have on alliance? Let me know what you think.

We have a passing and defense only robot, because we felt that everyone would try to pass and go for highgoals. That someone wouldnt be specialized for defense.

I don't think you can generalize about which design on your list is more valuable. I've seen catapult bots that dropped the ball when they stopped and couldn't make a shot, and catapult bots that score consistently, possess securely and pass smoothly. I'd be less concerned about the general design of the robot and more concerned about the robot's abilities on the field. Telling a pit scout "our pnumatic launcher hits the high goal every time" means nothing unless it's backed up on the field. This is why match scouting is so important.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by Joseph Smith

Telling a pit scout "our pnumatic launcher hits the high goal every time" means nothing unless it's backed up on the field. This is why match scouting is so important.

And the fun thing is, that shooter that works perfectly every time in qualifying might not be so hot when it is being heavily defended in the elimination rounds.

How your team performs under pressure is important.

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Originally Posted by MrForbes

How your team performs under pressure is important.

Moreso this year than most.

[Nemo]

This year's minimum competitive concept would be a JVN style collector on a kit drive, right? And add a bit of structure to make the ball stay in and make it easy to catch a soft toss from a human player.

Did anybody actually build that robot? I didn't see a single robot without a shooter at Central Illinois.

I bet there are plenty of robots this year that are less effective than a simple 6WD + JVN collector bot. It's a shame, because that robot is well within the reach of practically any FRC team. I bet it can be made with kit of parts + $200 or less.

[Joseph Smith]

Originally Posted by Nemo

This year's minimum competitive concept would be a JVN style collector on a kit drive, right? And add a bit of structure to make the ball stay in and make it easy to catch a soft toss from a human player.

Did anybody actually build that robot? I didn't see a single robot without a shooter at Central Illinois.

I bet there are plenty of robots this year that are less effective than a simple 6WD + JVN collector bot. It's a shame, because that robot is well within the reach of practically any FRC team. I bet it can be made with kit of parts + $200 or less.

What can a team learn by building the minimum competitive concept, with mechanisms that they already know will work? I know there are many teams that might do better if they went for a design like this, but by trying something more complex, they're exercising design and problem solving skills that could make them more successful in the future. I believe that it's more important to work hard and get ambitious, even if it doesn't all work perfectly, then go with the basic idea that you know will work but doesn't let you get creative.

[Nemo]

Originally Posted by Joseph Smith

What can a team learn by building the minimum competitive concept, with mechanisms that they already know will work? I know there are many teams that might do better if they went for a design like this, but by trying something more complex, they're exercising design and problem solving skills that could make them more successful in the future. I believe that it's more important to work hard and get ambitious, even if it doesn't all work perfectly, then go with the basic idea that you know will work but doesn't let you get creative.

I partly agree with this sentiment. I would argue, though, that up front complexity isn't required in order to be creative, work hard, and be ambitious. A team can do plenty of good work on a roller collector to make it incrementally better. It's pretty challenging to make them collect a ball that comes in from the side, for example. Teams get to decide where they want to put their focus, and I think it is great if a team chooses to pick one mechanism (even a seemingly simple one) and then really drill into the details of it and refine it to the best degree they can.

[kk052]

The thing is its not how something works, its about how WELL that thing works, kicker vs catapult isnt as relevant as working vs not.

[Joseph Smith]

Originally Posted by Nemo

I partly agree with this sentiment. I would argue, though, that up front complexity isn't required in order to be creative, work hard, and be ambitious. A team can do plenty of good work on a roller collector to make it incrementally better. It's pretty challenging to make them collect a ball that comes in from the side, for example. Teams get to decide where they want to put their focus, and I think it is great if a team chooses to pick one mechanism (even a seemingly simple one) and then really drill into the details of it and refine it to the best degree they can.

I would agree with this. I just feel that there's more of a sense of excitement and pride when you can explain to someone the creative, unique mechanism that you developed. I guess it depends on the team, but from my experience I'm always pleased when my team's bot is different and/or innovative.

[MrForbes]

You can be quite innovative, and build a simple, effective robot.

In fact, it usually takes more work to make something that's simple and functional and elegant, than to just throw a bunch of technology at the problem.

[RandeJ]

Being a rookie team, a shooter proved difficult. So the students decided to pick a simple but effective design - success! They ended up with a net assembly for catching/inbounding, and a door that can lower to pick up the ball or stay up to enclose it. During the St. Louis Regional, we had several truss catches and robots started coming up for a "kiss" assist where we passed while touching and never exposing the ball.

For defense, we were tall and had a basic, but high friction/power drive train (essentially KOP AM-14U).

We had a blast and the design proved very successful - highest rookie seed!

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RubsNF4zUTU

[SIIENGINEER]

To 4931 ..I am happy that my almamater(class of "81") has joined the FIRST ROBOTICS fun. Congratulations on a very successful first regional event. Your robot is very impressive. I will be attending Worlds again this year as my son is the Captain and driver for FIRST team 1986. I am looking forward to seeing you guys up close. Who knows maybe the teams will be in the same division and get to play together. GOOD LUCK at Worlds!!!!!!!