Petition to end the shouting of ROBOT

[yarb65]

Vote yes

[Mark Sheridan]

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur

I do see, and understand where you are coming from. And I agree that yelling is no excuse for unsafe practices (BTW: your statement is called a strawman argument, as I never said it was an excuse for acting unsafe, but you insinuated I meant that). That being said, informing those, who may not be paying attention, that there is a hazard in the area is prudent.

Again, I'm not for yelling "ROBOT" all the time, but I refuse to sign a petition that will keep me from alerting an otherwise oblivious person to a clear and present danger.

Sorry for pulling a strawman. my friends and i use that one too much, we will accuse each other positions until we sort it out. I guess it lends itself to making jokes at each other expense instead of actually making an point. Well enough of the red herring about red herrings.

Well I see your position a bit more clearly. To avoid putting more words in your mouth are you saying your reserving your right to yell to prevent a sudden accident or more of a general alert of the proximity of the robot?

I think Sanddrag intent in his original post to eliminate a need of using "Robot" as a siren or alarm. The need to alert someone immediately prevent an accident is not what this petition is about. there is no need for the continual reminders of robot presence. Shouting something to avoid a fall or collision is not what i am trying to address.

[hrench]

I'd like to go on record as a vote in favor of "Robot".

You know those beepers on the back of trucks when they back up? They're a safety item. They're to get attention. They're required by law and they save lives.

Sure, yelling "Robot" isn't saving lives, but the purpose of it is to make people aware that a big thing is coming through and they have to move. Most of those people's attention is focused elsewhere when the 'bot comes by.

Absolutely, you don't need to be 'rude' or 'arrogant' to yell robot, and you don't need to be excessively loud either. But in some pits, whether you're late or not, you'll need to clear the crowd to move a drive team through the pits.

And I've heard students reminesce about tournaments and that was one of the most fun things they remembered.

[Nirvash]

Originally Posted by hrench

Sure, yelling "Robot" isn't saving lives, but the purpose of it is to make people aware that a big thing is coming through and they have to move. Most of those people's attention is focused elsewhere when the 'bot comes by.

Robot traffic should stop for people, no one should 'have to' move out of the way to avoid injury. As many have stated, having one or two people infront of the robot is plenty to get people to step aside.

[Invictus3593]

The only reason my team does this is because we don't want to hit someone with our robot. If you're moving pretty quickly, there is a safety hazard present that you may hit a parent who doesn't know or a small kids who's running around. My point is, you don't know what could happen in the pits and, as you've already pointed out, they are loud and abnoxious. This means no one will automatically hear your robot coming and move out of the way.

So to recap my opinions:
1. It is necessary for safety
2. It's not arrogant, it's looking out for someone else
3. I agree, but do you have a better solution?
4. If keeping the pits safe is rude, yes
5. This point is just a repeat of 3
6. The bystanders are the ones who need it the most because they don't know that robots come through.
7. The "general public" that comes into a robotics competition should expect to see weird things at our events
8. The other teams yell to further the message to anyone in the way
9. With repitition, it becomes second nature to people that cooperate, this is not bad
10. How does it create a safety hazard? It's not like every time we yell "robot" someone's ears explode. If it does anything bad, it simply annoys people like you
11 No, it doesn't. Having done it for 4 years, I don't expect people to move out of the way, it's only announcing that a safety hazard is coming through the aisle.
12. I dont understand your wording here

I would like to work with everyone here to find a better way to announce the robot, even in the case that you're in a hurry. If I offended anyone in this I am sorry, I did not mean to. These are simply my opinions and that of my team.

I'll sign once I'm sure no one will be hurt by our robot coming through the aisle.

[BigJ]

Originally Posted by Invictus3593

I would like to work with everyone here to find a better way to announce the robot, even in the case that you're in a hurry.

In the OP you responded to the questions in:

Some of you may ask, "Well how can you move a robot safely without yelling 'ROBOT!' ?" It's simple. We're never in a rush, we look where we're going, and if for some reason we do encounter some impediment to our travel (which happens only rarely), we politely and in a reasonable volume say "excuse me" followed by a "thanks."

[Chris is me]

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur

I do see, and understand where you are coming from. And I agree that yelling is no excuse for unsafe practices (BTW: your statement is called a strawman argument, as I never said it was an excuse for acting unsafe, but you insinuated I meant that). That being said, informing those, who may not be paying attention, that there is a hazard in the area is prudent.

Again, I'm not for yelling "ROBOT" all the time, but I refuse to sign a petition that will keep me from alerting an otherwise oblivious person to a clear and present danger.

It would make sense to yell if you had little control of the robot, but you can stop the robot. If you have to tell someone very quickly or else they'll be in danger, then stop the cart. Then you don't have to yell.

We've been late for matches, rushing to the field, whatever, and we haven't had to shout robot in two years. On the off chance you absolutely have to, one time, no one is going to judge you. That's not what's going on.

I don't buy this "necessary" argument one bit. It's only necessary if you feel entitled to rush your robot through the pits as fast as you can go.

[JosephC]

Originally Posted by Invictus3593

... safety hazard present that you may hit a parent who doesn't know or a small kids who's running around.

6. The bystanders are the ones who need it the most because they don't know that robots come through.

How on earth, is a parent who's never been to a competition or a small child running around(who shouldn't be in the first place) supposed to know what to do when they hear someone yell "ROBOT"?

Originally Posted by Invictus3593

I would like to work with everyone here to find a better way to announce the robot, even in the case that you're in a hurry.

If you aren't in a hurry, tap people on their shoulders and politely ask them to move. If you are in a hurry, how about yelling "Robot coming through, excuse us!" or "Watch out, robot coming through!"


I highly doubt you go running through the shop yelling "ROBOT" so why should you do it at a competition?

[Siri]

Originally Posted by Invictus3593

1. It is necessary for safety
2. It's not arrogant, it's looking out for someone else
3. I agree, but do you have a better solution?
4. If keeping the pits safe is rude, yes
5. This point is just a repeat of 3
6. The bystanders are the ones who need it the most because they don't know that robots come through.
7. The "general public" that comes into a robotics competition should expect to see weird things at our events
8. The other teams yell to further the message to anyone in the way
9. With repitition, it becomes second nature to people that cooperate, this is not bad
10. How does it create a safety hazard? It's not like every time we yell "robot" someone's ears explode. If it does anything bad, it simply annoys people like you
11 No, it doesn't. Having done it for 4 years, I don't expect people to move out of the way, it's only announcing that a safety hazard is coming through the aisle.

1. Then you're doing safety incorrectly. Plenty of teams, not to mention industries, manage their transportation safely without yelling. If you're in danger of hitting a small kid running around--if you're creating a potentially unsafe situation at all, you need to change your behavior, not your vocalizations. It is our job to avoid others. If there's no way though, ask them to move gently and directly. Ask because you need to get through, not because it's unsafe--it shouldn't be in any way unsafe to begin with.
2. Yes, say "excuse me".
6. The bystanders don't need to be yelled at to inform them of this. It's effectively crying wolf.
8. This is entirely unnecessary. If someone is actually in your way, ask them to move. Don't relay the message to areas that are not or not yet in your path. Again, people who are actually hampering movement are less likely to respond.
10. The louder we make it, the harder it is to hear actual emergencies. It is distracting, and while I'm glad your answer to 11 is true for you, it enforces a sense of entitlement for many, which enhances the danger.

Originally Posted by Invictus3593

I would like to work with everyone here to find a better way to announce the robot, even in the case that you're in a hurry. If I offended anyone in this I am sorry, I did not mean to. These are simply my opinions and that of my team.

I'll sign once I'm sure no one will be hurt by our robot coming through the aisle.

"Please excuse our robot." If someone is not within that standard listening distance, they are not in your way. If a standard movement they could make could cause them injury on your robot, you're doing it wrong.

[Richard Wallace]

Is barging through a crowded place, while yelling* at people to get out of your way, a good example of professional behavior? Of graciousness?

If you don't know, ask your grandmother.

------
*Robot! Or any word.

[Mr. Van]

If yelling anything is part of safety practice, then we're not doing enough.

Safety Rule T6: In order to maintain safe robot transportation during an event, all teams must employ the follow safety procedures:
1. A ROBOT moving through the pit must be accompanied by emergency lights flashing yellow at all corners of the ROBOT or cart that transports the robot.
2. An alarm of no less than 100db must blare a continuous "siren-like" warning to alert people that there is a ROBOT in the vicinity that may be moving on a cart.
3. The ROBOT or cart must be surrounded by soft fluffy pillows or cushions of no less than 5" depth (tastefully upholstered) from a height of 6" to 60" from the ground.
4. A moving robot must be proceeded by a team member wearing an "international orange" safety vest who must carry an incense burner not unlike a thurible...

Seriously, of course you can yell "Look out!" or "Stop!" or "Don't move!" or even "Robot behind you!" whenever there might be an impending collision. The problem is that so many are yelling when it is NOT necessary that it completely removes any impact that such appropriate warnings might have. It's like yelling "FIRE!!!" "FIRE!!!" over and over again to warn people of the possibility of a fire.

- Mr. Van
Coach, Robodox

[EricH]

Originally Posted by hrench

I'd like to go on record as a vote in favor of "Robot".

You know those beepers on the back of trucks when they back up? They're a safety item. They're to get attention. They're required by law and they save lives.

Sure, yelling "Robot" isn't saving lives, but the purpose of it is to make people aware that a big thing is coming through and they have to move. Most of those people's attention is focused elsewhere when the 'bot comes by.

And the beepers are NEVER on when the truck is moving forwards. Imagine for a few minutes that every beeper on every truck starts up whenever it's in a drive gear, reverse, forwards, whatever.

How fast do you think you'd start ignoring them?


Right. The point of the beepers is to inform people that a truck is moving in reverse and that the driver probably can't see behind him very well because the truck body is blocking his view, thus they NEED to know so they can get out of the way. When the same truck is in forwards, the driver can see what's in front of him, and the driver has responsibility to avoid anything in the way.


The shouts of robot are: The truck using its beeper when in a drive gear, accompanied by every car on the road in some cases. VERY annoying, and if used too much, VERY ignored. That's why we want to reduce the use as much as possible. Can it be effective? Yes--in the right situation. Are there better ways? YES. Like having one of your 4-person drive team going in front of the robot to clear a path.

[yash101]

What about putting a horn on the robot cart and hoping it gets people out of the way?

Yeah. I think I'll skip that [at least for now]. Playing with the horn on our 2012 bot was only fun the first time

I think there needs to be some hotword that should be used. What about tobar?

[artdutra04]

Originally Posted by EricH

The shouts of robot are: The truck using its beeper when in a drive gear, accompanied by every car on the road in some cases. VERY annoying, and if used too much, VERY ignored. That's why we want to reduce the use as much as possible. Can it be effective? Yes--in the right situation. Are there better ways? YES. Like having one of your 4-person drive team going in front of the robot to clear a path.

It's a well known fact that in some parts of the world such as China, you gain right of way while driving by honking more than the other driver.




// Well actually only half lying. There are definitely people there who think they can gain right of way by honking more.

[robochick1319]

I believe that the best compromise is this:

"Excuse us, robot coming through!" This saying alongside 1 or 2 robot escorts should be enough to clear enough space for traveling through. Encouraging students to NOT say ANYTHING creates more hazards when moving robots.