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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:15
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

"Strategies aimed at and/or game play resulting in the damage, destruction or inhibition of opponent ROBOTS via actions such as high-speed or repeated, aggressive ramming, attachment, damage, tipping, or entanglement of ROBOTS are not allowed."

Is defense legal? Any effective defense inhibits a robot. Most defenders use "strategies" or "game play" that result in "inhibition of opponent ROBOTS" by "ramming". All defense is "repeated"; very rarely does a defending team only "ram" another robot only once. "Aggressive" is a subjective term, but I'd argue that all defense is aggressive. "Ramming" as opposed to pushing is also very subjective, especially if you collide with another team that's moving quickly. If this type of foul is called often, then I anticipate many upset teams and inconsistent refereeing.

EDIT: I feel this is quite a bit unfair to teams who, unlike the GDC, realized that in a full open field with no protected areas ramming and high speed collisions would happen a lot, and decided to build incredibly strong and robust robots with the ability to ram teams if they need to. I know there are teams who wouldn't have built their robot if the rule was like this.

Last edited by magnets : 20-03-2014 at 16:17.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:18
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

Could someone explain what -"damage"- used the second time in the first sentence means? The one that comes after the word "attachment".
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:20
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by johnr View Post
Could someone explain what -"damage"- used the second time in the first sentence means? The one that comes after the word "attachment".
Anything the already overburdened refs manage to have time to watch between their other million things to do. Sorry guys, hope you all brought your second and third pairs of eyes.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:20
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by johnr View Post
Could someone explain what -"damage"- used the second time in the first sentence means? The one that comes after the word "attachment".
If you remove the other ways to get the penalty, you end up with an incredibly redundant sentence.

Strategies aimed at and/or game play resulting in the damage of opponent ROBOTS via actions such as damage are not allowed.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:21
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by magnets View Post
If you remove the other ways to get the penalty, you end up with an incredibly redundant sentence.

Strategies aimed at and/or game play resulting in the damage of opponent ROBOTS via actions such as damage are not allowed.
That could be because the formatting of the actual update is not properly copied here.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:23
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

Playing defense on a poorly assembled robot = automatic Technical Foul...lovely. Just what this game needed ::rolls eyes::
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:24
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by RufflesRidge View Post
That could be because the formatting of the actual update is not properly copied here.
Thanks. I missed that.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:25
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

According to the letter of this update, I could surround my robot in acrylic panels and draw technicals when people break them. As long as the acrylic doesn't exist solely to draw fouls (i.e. has sponsor stickers on it, "protects robot internals from damage") it's not illegal, just a bad design.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:27
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Chris is me View Post
According to the letter of this update, I could surround my robot in acrylic panels and draw technicals when people break them. As long as the acrylic doesn't exist solely to draw fouls (i.e. has sponsor stickers on it, "protects robot internals from damage") it's not illegal, just a bad design.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:27
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Michael Hill View Post
Playing defense on a poorly assembled robot = automatic Technical Foul...lovely. Just what this game needed ::rolls eyes::
Vice versa, does this mean a poorly assembled robot playing defense on a more powerful or fast machine that in an attempt to break out of a defensive hold is now causing the offensive bot to draw a foul or tech foul?
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:32
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Jared Russell View Post
In principle, I like that they are trying to remove the BattleBots element of this game.

In practice, they just added a bunch more things that the already-overworked referees need to be watching for.
"In practice"

Please wait to declare how something plays out "in practice" until there are more than 0 qualification matches played with the current rules.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:33
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Chris is me View Post
According to the letter of this update, I could surround my robot in acrylic panels and draw technicals when people break them. As long as the acrylic doesn't exist solely to draw fouls (i.e. has sponsor stickers on it, "protects robot internals from damage") it's not illegal, just a bad design.
Only if it was caused by "high-speed or repeated, aggressive ramming"
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:36
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

If you want an effective defense, build a goalie bot, or modify your Robot to be one.
Worth more than all the rammings and deflections combined.
Blocking a 10 point shot with its attendant time penalty is a game changer.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:36
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Brandon Zalinsky View Post
"In practice"

Please wait to declare how something plays out "in practice" until there are more than 0 qualification matches played with the current rules.
Based on my experiences as a referee this year, Jared is making a pretty safe assumption.
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Unread 20-03-2014, 16:38
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Re: Unscheduled Team Update: 3-20-2014

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Originally Posted by Brandon Zalinsky View Post
"In practice"

Please wait to declare how something plays out "in practice" until there are more than 0 qualification matches played with the current rules.
Here's what I imagine could happen to the poor referees. A team is about to score and win, but a defense bot knocks the ball out of the robot by colliding with it, which "inhibits" them from scoring. After the match, the team will come up to the question box, say that we were "inhibited" because a robot came into contact with us more than one time (satisfying the repeated or high-speed part), and that it should be considered ramming if it was violent enough to knock the ball loose. The ref has to make the call if the robot was being "rammed" or not to decide the technical foul, which isn't an easy decision, especially if it's the final on Einstein...
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