Go to Post Hopefully LMFAO will cross paths with FRC71. They've been shufflin' since 2002. - Taylor [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > Technical > Electrical
CD-Media   CD-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Closed Thread
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 2 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
  #1   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 17:08
Maximillian's Avatar
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
Registered User
AKA: Max Westwater
FRC #5254 (HYPE)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Worcester, MA; NY
Posts: 99
Maximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant future
Legal battery chargers this year.

My team was wondering about what chargers are legal this year. We have heard that in past years there has been a 6 amp limit but this year we cant find anything talking about chargers in either the game or administrative manual.

Does anyone have any clarification on this rule?
  #2   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 17:16
Nirvash's Avatar
Nirvash Nirvash is offline
Registered User
AKA: Bryan
FRC #4676
Team Role: Programmer
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Orland Park, IL
Posts: 221
Nirvash has a spectacular aura aboutNirvash has a spectacular aura about
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximillian View Post
My team was wondering about what chargers are legal this year. We have heard that in past years there has been a 6 amp limit but this year we cant find anything talking about chargers in either the game or administrative manual.

Does anyone have any clarification on this rule?
You can not charge a battery at a rate higher then 6 amps, (about the max charge rate of the batteries we use) This is stated in the safety manual.

This is generally enforced by limiting chargers to a max rate of 6 amps. However certain special conditions could allow a charger with a max rate greater then 6 amps to be used.
__________________
Team 3488 - Electrical Lead/Programming Lead 2011-2013
Team 4676 - Electrical/Programming Mentor 2013-Present
  #3   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 17:19
Ether's Avatar
Ether Ether is offline
systems engineer (retired)
no team
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Rookie Year: 1969
Location: US
Posts: 8,125
Ether has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond reputeEther has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximillian View Post
My team was wondering about what chargers are legal this year. We have heard that in past years there has been a 6 amp limit but this year we cant find anything talking about chargers in either the game or administrative manual.

Does anyone have any clarification on this rule?
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...3&postcount=11


  #4   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 21:31
Maximillian's Avatar
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
Registered User
AKA: Max Westwater
FRC #5254 (HYPE)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Worcester, MA; NY
Posts: 99
Maximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant future
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ether View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nirvash View Post
You can not charge a battery at a rate higher then 6 amps, (about the max charge rate of the batteries we use) This is stated in the safety manual.

This is generally enforced by limiting chargers to a max rate of 6 amps. However certain special conditions could allow a charger with a max rate greater then 6 amps to be used.
Thanks for the help.

My team is also wondering how many batteries your team brings to competition. We have a 6 CIM drivetrain and are worried about not having enough batteries fully charged.
  #5   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 23:17
Bill_B Bill_B is offline
You cannot not make a difference
FRC #2170
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,099
Bill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond reputeBill_B has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

I consider 6 batteries to be an absolute minimum for a competition. Now that we are a district, with 12 matches (at least) per event, this became an even more solid conviction. We have a charger cart with four chargers that makes us comfortable with 8 batteries. This partly due to doing only one match per battery and monitoring the battery state after each match just before it joins the charging cycle. At matches we set the charge rate to 4a.

Giving each battery a name will also help you keep track of the good versus the marginal performers and allow a cogent cycle of use to be formed for them. We use a battery beak to monitor the battery state. They are pricey, but the beak helps you manage your several hundred dollar investment in electron storage and feel confident that your robot has as decent a chance at getting through a match as you can give it. You also get the chance to see which of your stable of energy may only be suitable for practice or control system testing.
__________________
Nature's Fury FLL team 830 - F L eLements
FRC team 2170 - Titanium Tomahawks
  #6   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 23:18
cgmv123's Avatar
cgmv123 cgmv123 is offline
FRC RI/FLL Field Manager
AKA: Max Vrany
FRC #1306 (BadgerBOTS)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 2,089
cgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond reputecgmv123 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximillian View Post
My team is also wondering how many batteries your team brings to competition. We have a 6 CIM drivetrain and are worried about not having enough batteries fully charged.
With 6 CIMs, you'll most likely want a new battery every match. This will come up most in eliminations. There are extra batteries available for teams in eliminations that need to play back to back matches, but plan on having at least 6 batteries fully charged and ready to go for eliminations.
__________________
BadgerBOTS Robotics|@team1306|Facebook: BadgerBOTS
2016 FIRST Championship Tesla Division | 2016 Wisconsin Regional Engineering Inspiration Award

2015 FIRST Championship Carson Division | 2015 Wisconsin Regional Chairman's Award

2013 FIRST Championship Curie Division | 2013 Wisconsin Regional Chairman's Award

2012 FIRST Championship Archimedes Division | 2012 Wisconsin Regional Engineering Inspiration Award, Woodie Flowers Finalist Award (Lead Mentor Ben Senson)

  #7   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 22-03-2014, 23:27
Calvin Hartley's Avatar
Calvin Hartley Calvin Hartley is offline
Registered User
FRC #4967 (That ONE Team)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Rookie Year: 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Posts: 513
Calvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud ofCalvin Hartley has much to be proud of
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

We have a 3-charge bank and bring plenty of batteries. I think we bring 10-12ish, but I am not sure. We change the battery before every match.
__________________

FRC 4967 That ONE Team 2013-Present, Founder, CAD/Everything Mentor
FRC 2771 Code Red Robotics 2012 and 2013 Drive Team, 2014 Drive Coach, Executive Leadership
FLL Team member 2005-2010, LEGO In Paradise,
FLL Mentor 2009-Present Paradise Teams (nine teams)
FLL Coach 2014-Present - The Lightning Bugs



Gracious Professionalism isn't a set of rules to follow, it's an attitude.
  #8   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-03-2014, 01:49
TikiTech's Avatar
TikiTech TikiTech is offline
Mr. H
FRC #3880 (Tiki Techs)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Rookie Year: 2011
Location: Kailua-Kona, Hawaii
Posts: 252
TikiTech is just really niceTikiTech is just really niceTikiTech is just really niceTikiTech is just really niceTikiTech is just really nice
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

I think the amount of batteries will depend on how you use them. Previous years with us not using pneumatics, 4-6 batteries with two chargers was very adequate.

If you have a lot of pneumatics and plan on pre charging a bunch of tanks in queue you could need quite a few batteries and chargers to keep up.

This year we are using a lot of pneumatics and are bringing 10 new batteries and some of our previous years batteries for pit demos (LED shows and such for the pit visitors). We will be bringing 5 (6amp) chargers as well. We also plan on using the previous matches battery for the pneumatic pre charging and swapping in a fully charged battery when the robot is ready to load on the field.

Good luck this season,

Aloha!
__________________
Team 3880 - "Tiki Techs" "Mr. H" - Tiki Technologies Coach / Mentor
Kealakehe High School Robotics - Kailua-Kona, Hawaii
__________________________________________________ _____________________________
2016 Hopper Division | Orlando Regional Engineering Inspiration Award | Hawaii Regional Chairman's Award & Finalist & Woodie Flowers Finalist
2015 Carson Division | Silicon Valley Regional Engineering Inspiration Award | HI Regional Regional Winners & Engineering Inspiration & Deans List Finalist
2014 Newton Division | Hawaii Regional Engineering Inspiration Award & Deans List Finalist
2013 Newton Division | Inland Empire Regional Regional Chairman's & Creativity Award | Los Angles Regional Engineering Inspiration Award | | HI Regional
2012 Curie Division | Hawaii Regional Engineering Inspiration Award
2011 Newton Division | Hawaii Regional Regional Winners & Industrial Design Award
.
__________________________________________________ _____________________________
  #9   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-03-2014, 10:20
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 10,798
Al Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximillian View Post
We have a 6 CIM drivetrain and are worried about not having enough batteries fully charged.
You might want to be worried about tripping the main breaker. At least two teams in Wisconsin tripped multiple times with a six motor drive train.
__________________
Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
________________________
Storming the Tower since 1996.
  #10   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-03-2014, 18:51
Maximillian's Avatar
Maximillian Maximillian is offline
Registered User
AKA: Max Westwater
FRC #5254 (HYPE)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Rookie Year: 2014
Location: Worcester, MA; NY
Posts: 99
Maximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant futureMaximillian has a brilliant future
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz View Post
You might want to be worried about tripping the main breaker. At least two teams in Wisconsin tripped multiple times with a six motor drive train.
We were kind of worried about this being an issue. I hope it doesn't end up being a huge problem.
  #11   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-03-2014, 20:14
CENTURION's Avatar
CENTURION CENTURION is offline
King of unreasonable designs
AKA: Evan the Shop Princess
FRC #1306 (BadgerBOTS)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: May 2010
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 278
CENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant futureCENTURION has a brilliant future
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Skierkiewicz View Post
You might want to be worried about tripping the main breaker. At least two teams in Wisconsin tripped multiple times with a six motor drive train.
Oh, is that why 2481 kept dying during eliminations? I know in at least two (maybe it was three) matches, they dropped dead in the middle of the field (no signal light), after a rough pushing match.
__________________
FRC #1306 - BadgerBOTS - Mechanical/Machining/Safety/Marketing Mentor
FTC #6806 - Ratchet Robotics - Head/Founding Mentor
2010 - Wisconsin Regional Chairman's Award Winner - Wisconsin Regional Quarter-finalist - Curie Division #5 Seed, Quarter-finalist
2011 - Wisconsin Regional Innovation in Control Award Winner - Wisconsin Regional Quarter-finalist
2012 - Wisconsin Regional Engineering Inspiration Award Winner - Wisconsin Regional Semi-finalist
2013 - Wisconsin Regional Chairman's Award Winner


  #12   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 23-03-2014, 23:44
kylelanman's Avatar
kylelanman kylelanman is offline
Programming Mentor
AKA: Kyle
FRC #2481 (Roboteers)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Tremont Il
Posts: 191
kylelanman is a name known to allkylelanman is a name known to allkylelanman is a name known to allkylelanman is a name known to allkylelanman is a name known to allkylelanman is a name known to all
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CENTURION View Post
Oh, is that why 2481 kept dying during eliminations? I know in at least two (maybe it was three) matches, they dropped dead in the middle of the field (no signal light), after a rough pushing match.
Yes in between SF 1 and SF 2 we switched out the main breaker. After that it never flipped again. We were also cooling it between matches. Realize we had 8 motors for our swerve drive. 4 CIMs and 4 BB RS775(I think). The wires between our battery and PDB were getting quite warm so we are planning on lowering the gauge for nationals to better handle the current.
__________________
"May the coms be with you"

Is this a "programming error" or a "programmer error"?

  #13   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-03-2014, 00:06
Alan Anderson's Avatar
Alan Anderson Alan Anderson is offline
Software Architect
FRC #0045 (TechnoKats)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Kokomo, Indiana
Posts: 9,113
Alan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond reputeAlan Anderson has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

I saw three robots with tripped main breakers at the Boilermaker regional. In each case, only one of the wires was warm. The apparent cause was not too much current, but simply too much heat from a poor connection caused by a loose nut where the wire connects to the breaker.

Loose main power connections -- on battery terminals, SB-50 connectors, main circuit breakers, and/or Power Distribution Board inputs -- were unfortunately very common. It'll be interesting to see if the logging feature of next year's PDB will help convince certain teams that their general animosity toward "the FMS" is misplaced, and that their loss of robot control on the field can usually be prevented with a bit more attention in the pits to checking and maintaining the robot's electrical system.
  #14   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-03-2014, 00:11
SoftwareBug2.0's Avatar
SoftwareBug2.0 SoftwareBug2.0 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Eric
FRC #1425 (Error Code Xero)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Tigard, Oregon
Posts: 487
SoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant futureSoftwareBug2.0 has a brilliant future
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cgmv123 View Post
With 6 CIMs, you'll most likely want a new battery every match.
I didn't realize teams did anything different.
  #15   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 24-03-2014, 09:35
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 10,798
Al Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond reputeAl Skierkiewicz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Legal battery chargers this year.

Kyle,
I think the drivers just became a little less aggressive in the subsequent matches as I had suggested. If you go back to the old ways, this problem will revisit you. You know I have a vested interest in keeping you guys running, you gifted me and I am returning the favor.
__________________
Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
________________________
Storming the Tower since 1996.
Closed Thread


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 19:23.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi