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#1
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New Championship Layout 2015
FIRST just announced that the 2015 FIRST Championship in St. Louis will take place in 3 venues. FLL & FTC will be in different venues while FRC will remain in the Edward Jones Dome and Convention Center.
I think it's a big change that could be a sign that the FRC Championship will be bigger next year. 6 fields? 600 teams? I'm interested in what people think about this change. |
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#2
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
Be prepared for 8 divisions next year. This move by FIRST is massive.
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#3
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
Playing field will be double the size. Gotta have room for the splashes of the water.
/sarcasm But in all seriouness this is crazy. Good crazy. Interesting how it seems like this means the field of teams will be bigger when it seems like FIRST has been trying to downsize Champs... |
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#4
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
I hope that having dedicated venues means that FLL and FTC will have their championships grow as well. Both, FLL especially, have had a criminally low number of championship teams given the size of the programs.
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#5
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
I believe it's FLL in the Renaissance Grand, with JrFLL and FTC at Union Station. The latter venue seems a bit far, doesn't it?
If they want to use the entire America's Center for FRC, I think there's one big implication: 8 fields (either 2 per division or 8 divisions). Which is an awesome idea. We get to expand AND increase matches/team. |
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#6
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
It will be interesting to see how this plays out. St Louis does not seem to have the infrastructure to support another 200 teams.
It also seems questionable whether there are another 200 teams that deserve to be at Champs. |
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#7
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
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#8
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
You really want to have to scout 2 different fields at one competition?
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#9
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
As long as the fields aren't too far apart, it might not be too bad. A pain, yes, but I'm all about more matches.
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#10
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
If I were FIRST, I'd go to 8 divisions of 60 teams. 80 more teams means Championship won't overflow (which it was probably going to). Fewer teams per division means there'll be easily 12+ matches/team.
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#11
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
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And Justin, I dont think the EJD can handle 8 full FRC fields. Can it? |
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#12
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
If I'm not mistaken, this is what the footprint layout will look like. The yellow line is about 1 mile, as-the-crow-flies from the entrance to the Dome to Union Station.
![]() Last edited by Hallry : 25-04-2014 at 13:44. |
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#13
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
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Personally, I think 4x doublefield divisions are more likely than 8x singlefield. Using doublefield divisions reduces the noise pollution issue (since 2 fields share a common audio feed), doesn't add a round to Einstein (which is already pinched for time), doesn't need as many volunteers as 8 divisions (but DOES need *some* more than 4x singlefield). Additionally, doublefield divisions have much higher match throughput. 8x singlefield gives more matches/team by reducing the number of teams playing in a division. 4x doublefield improves utilization. Also: I don't understand why people say scouting a doublefield division is too difficult. The fields are adjacent to one another, you can sit centrally and watch both. In 2004 and 2006 the Canadian/Toronto regional did exactly this, and it worked just fine. They played with 12 and 16 Elims alliances too. Last edited by Racer26 : 25-04-2014 at 10:55. |
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#14
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
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![]() (Image credit: Patrick Flynn) Quote:
Quote:
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Last edited by Hallry : 25-04-2014 at 12:24. |
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#15
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Re: New Championship Layout 2015
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I calculated several years ago (2011 IIRC) that you can fit 10 FRC fields (I think I calculated on 40'x70' plots), on an NFL Football field. Both Georgia Dome and EJD have floors considerably larger than an NFL field (EJD is bigger). Quote:
Instead of doubling the number, you increase it by some (say, 30-50%), and give the people (who will be working harder due to the non-stop nature of a double field event) more breaks more often. Remember: We're getting a new control system (and likely upgraded/new FMS to go with it). There is no reason that it couldn't be designed to support 2 sets of field hardware from a single scorpion-case-replacement. Quote:
Doublefield divisions don't need to double SOME of the field equipment (mostly the computers) and don't need to double the volunteers, just increase it some. They don't generate quite 2x the throughput though. They get maybe ~85-90% of the way. I worked out last year, that each of our four divisions could go up to 140 teams/division, 12 matches per team by doublefielding the divisions, without extending the schedule at all. Additionally, doublefield divisions allow you to run a 16-alliance elimination bracket in approximately the same time frame, which gets more teams into CMP elims. Quote:
Toronto used to be played in an OHL Hockey Arena (Hershey Centre) with 5,500 seats. From what I recall, there were plenty of open seats still. EJD seats 66,000. (AFAIK, we stick mostly to the 1xx series sections, which represent maybe 40% of EJD's total, still ~6x bigger than Hershey Centre for an event a little over 4x the size). |
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