LAS VEGAS REGIONAL... terminated?

[Cory]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

While it may lose some of the travel appeal, has serious consideration been given to alternative sites in Nevada that may end up being cheaper or have more local support?

I'm not sure where else you could do it besides Reno, which is also big on casinos and entertainment.

[DELurker]

Originally Posted by Uniwersel

I lived in Las Vegas as a freshman, and I can't think of any high school in the area that could support a regional with 50 teams attending. Most of the high schools are based on one of two designs, both of which are similar in size. The high school I went to had a 3 court basketball gym, with a small practice gym attached. There would be space for the field, which would be extremely cramped, but no room for pits.

Coming in late to this discussion...

If you move the event to a district-sized venue, you need to have a district-sized attendance. The description one poster gave of a 3-court gym with a practice gym on the side is all you need. Put bleachers over two of the courts and the field on one and there's your arena. Turn the side gym and maybe another mid-sized room into the pits, and you have a district-sized venue suitable for 40 teams. This describes most of the MAR districts I've attended as well as many of the off-season events on the east coast.

More on-topic: It's disappointing that LVR cannot garner more sponsorship to make this a dead issue. I hate seeing Regionals go away without some form of replacement. Would Nellis AFB be able to provide some form of DOD sponsorship grant?

I would encourage any teams who are looking at folding due to this potential setback to reconsider. There are regional events within 300 miles of LV that are viable. My 11-person team travels 2+ hours each way (about 140 miles each way) to our two district events each year. It's taken some changes in how we approach the events to reduce our costs (drive team only for the first night before competition), but we've done it with a minimal budget. If nothing else, have the students approach this as another design problem: how do we find more money?

[Ether]

FWIW. All to same scale.

[Scott_4140]

The engineering community in Las Vegas is smaller than most cities its size. That's not the industry that Las Vegas grew up around. That would be the gambling and entertainment industry. Unfortunately, as pointed out by another post, their interests and therefore support, doesn't align well with FIRST.

There is however a companion industry that could line up with FIRST. Conventions! Conventions are a huge draw for the hotels and casinos in Las Vegas. Many of these conventions are technology oriented. The Consumer Electronics Show (CES) being one of the most well know.

The promoters of these technology driven conventions have a vested interest in furthering the industries they support. I would think a case could be made to them that sponsorship of an FRC Regional Completion aligns with their interests and could be promoted to their attending companies.

[JB987]

Exterior image of Las Vegas High School makes it look big but looks can be deceiving. Yes the field could fit in the main gym but the aux gym can only handle 30 pits max (with no room for even a quarter practice field. Additional halls or cafeteria on other side of outside multi-level quad area where you might fit more pits require elements exposed trip across the quad where ramps are...yes it does rain in Vegas (only on event days of course ). Remember, we were told we have to plan to have at least 40 teams to keep the regional (in addition to increased funds).

School pictured is one of almost 20 clones and same as Cimarron-Memorial HS, home of my High Rollers. Believe me we have pitched the idea of the event in our own school. Costs for usage and generators needed add up to venue costs at current Cashman Event Center, many times bigger. All other schools smaller or similar size with same usage constraints. I wonder, by the way, how many out of state teams (like many teams from across the country or ocean who have competed here) would come all this way to compete in a gym? As stated, however, the main concern is difficulties garnering financial support...and there are strong efforts in the works to ensure sufficient funding for the event.

One sad irony of this that FIRST appears comfortable with doing away with an event that has cost them $20-30k yet netted them at least $160k in mostly all second/third event registrations...

[JB987]

Originally Posted by Scott_4140

The engineering community in Las Vegas is smaller than most cities its size. That's not the industry that Las Vegas grew up around. That would be the gambling and entertainment industry. Unfortunately, as pointed out by another post, their interests and therefore support, doesn't align well with FIRST.

There is however a companion industry that could line up with FIRST. Conventions! Conventions are a huge draw for the hotels and casinos in Las Vegas. Many of these conventions are technology oriented. The Consumer Electronics Show (CES) being one of the most well know.

The promoters of these technology driven conventions have a vested interest in furthering the industries they support. I would think a case could be made to them that sponsorship of an FRC Regional Completion aligns with their interests and could be promoted to their attending companies.

The case has been made, somewhat successfully already. The Convention and Visitors Authority made the Cashman Field venue available to us this past few years for just a few thousand dollars space rental and around $12k for portable seating...(instead of tens of thousands as any other user would pay to lease the property for 4 days).

[Bob Steele]

My suggestion would be to try and find out if any of FIRST's major supporters have major conventions in LV. If they do... they might be able to put some pressure on local concerns regarding supporting the FIRST Regional.

If LV were to drop a big convention... it could cost them millions in revenue.
Supporting FIRST is such a small piece ....
Are there any big LV conventions that have a Tech orientation...you might be able to use that as a way for LV to see that this is good for them.

$100,000 in support is really a drop in the bucket for some of these venues.
I am not sure how to do it but trying to find a way of appealing to any kinds of tech things that happen there might be an idea.

[Lil' Lavery]

Some of the entertainment options in Vegas do employ engineers, namely some of the bigger stage shows. I know Cirque du Soleil used to be represented on the FRC GDC. I wonder if approaching these directly may be more beneficial?

Originally Posted by Cory

I'm not sure where else you could do it besides Reno, which is also big on casinos and entertainment.

I realize Reno is also a gambling/entertainment driven city, but perhaps the University of Nevada, Reno may be a more affordable venue or more generous sponsor than UNLV? Same can be said for other universities around the state, even if they're in lesser known locations. MAR Championship has been held in a relatively remote location (Bethlehem, PA) the past two years because the venue price was substantially lower than Philadelphia. I was checking to see if this was an avenue the LVRPC has explored.

[JB987]

Originally Posted by Bob Steele

My suggestion would be to try and find out if any of FIRST's major supporters have major conventions in LV. If they do... they might be able to put some pressure on local concerns regarding supporting the FIRST Regional.

If LV were to drop a big convention... it could cost them millions in revenue.
Supporting FIRST is such a small piece ....
Are there any big LV conventions that have a Tech orientation...you might be able to use that as a way for LV to see that this is good for them.

$100,000 in support is really a drop in the bucket for some of these venues.
I am not sure how to do it but trying to find a way of appealing to any kinds of tech things that happen there might be an idea.

There are many major tech related conventions and we have pitched support for our regional many times. My team is usually the team that attends and represents local robotics efforts and FIRST Nevada with demos and positive interaction with major companies present and the group putting on the shows hasn't born fruit yet (even with follow up of course). Minor support for our team has resulted a few times, but no luck getting support for our regional.

Starting to sound like I am defensive so I am going to back off on explanations for awhile. Everybody's suggestions have been and still are appreciated...keep up the sharing of ideas as something positive may come of the exchange of ideas!

[Scott_4140]

The LV Convention Center covers many of the large conventions. Sounds like you're well connected there. There are many more conventions that deal directly with the larger hotel chains. The convention center is not going to have listings for those conventions.

The convention center and the hotels are not typically the promoters of the event. They may be willing to connect you, although I'm guessing they're going to hold their contacts pretty tight to the vest. Fortunately, most of the promoters are actively on the internet promoting their conventions. Once you have a list of all the technical ones in town, you should be able to dig up your own contact list.

This should be straight forward for any going through the Las Vegas Convention and Visitors Authority. This will get you about half of your potential targets. Beyond that, you'll need to search the larger hotels with convention facilities.

Demonstrations at the events are going to connect you with the attending companies. Unless they're from Las Vegas, you're not going to get much direct support there. It does help the general visibility of FIRST.

[AdamHeard]

I think what we should be focusing on here is not what the Vegas planning community can do to raise more money (they seem like they know their stuff and are working on it), but rather the rationale of cancelling an event that in theory is profitable.

[Scott_4140]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

I think what we should be focusing on here is not what the Vegas planning community can do to raise more money (they seem like they know their stuff and are working on it), but rather the rationale of cancelling an event that in theory is profitable.

There are lots of potential behind the scenes motives. We will never know unless FIRST decides to share.

To be efficient FIRST needs to manage all the events like a business. This appears to be the main factor here. Low performing "stores" get closed, so you can open at a different location just a block away. So the block here, is in anther state. Case by case handling sets a precedent they may not want to deal with.

If you look at the CA District angle, this is one more incentive to push CA into the District model. Forces CA to get it done! It's in their best interest to if Las Vegas might go away.

This is only 2 of dozens of potential motives.

[JB987]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

Some of the entertainment options in Vegas do employ engineers, namely some of the bigger stage shows. I know Cirque du Soleil used to be represented on the FRC GDC. I wonder if approaching these directly may be more beneficial?



I realize Reno is also a gambling/entertainment driven city, but perhaps the University of Nevada, Reno may be a more affordable venue or more generous sponsor than UNLV? Same can be said for other universities around the state, even if they're in lesser known locations. MAR Championship has been held in a relatively remote location (Bethlehem, PA) the past two years because the venue price was substantially lower than Philadelphia. I was checking to see if this was an avenue the LVRPC has explored.

Cirque is a sponsor our regional for $10k and the affiliated SoloTec that helps produce their shows provides us under cost AV for venue...and helps to make the regional a top notch event. Reno has no teams and is barely able to support an FLL and FTC event. Given FIRST's concern that growth hasn't been strong enough I don't think they would endorse moving the regional to Reno even if they had a workable venue. There are only two universities in the state and the few smaller colleges do not have venues that fit our needs. The only facility at UNLV that can handle an event is the aforementioned Thomas and Mack, not owned by the university, with a 20k seat arena that has gotten way to expensive for us to use (great when we had it though ) The attached Cox Pavilion is too small to host an event.

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by Scott_4140

If you look at the CA District angle, this is one more incentive to push CA into the District model. Forces CA to get it done! It's in their best interest to if Las Vegas might go away.

NO. No it's not.

Hurt teams (who mostly have no idea about these goings on) to force a point?

I know that can't possibly be FIRST's motive.

[JB987]

Thank you Adam