Robotics Programs for younger students

[rkoripalli]

Hi everyone,

Currently my school district has 1 robotics team. An FRC team that students from all 4 high schools are a part of. One of our long term goals is to have some robotics program in all of the elementary and middle schools in our district as well.

We want some advice on how other teams are doing this. What programs do you use? VEX and FLL seem to be the popular options. Also, our team is funded by the robotics booster club, would it be good to fund the other teams from this booster club as well? One of the biggest obstacles we expect to face is finding a sponsor for the team from each school. How do you suggest finding teachers who will want to help out?

[Tungrus]

Graduation path in FIRST family:

1: Jr. FLL >> FLL >> FTC >> FRC
2: Jr. FLL >> FLL >> FTC
3: Jr. FLL >> FLL >> FRC

[Dale]

Both Vex and FLL are good options. Part of your decision might be what is most popular in your area. You don't want to travel far to a competition. I've been leading FLL teams for the last 13 years so most of what I'll say is from that perspective.

The experience of students will vary greatly depending on the coaches and teammates. You are right to focus on finding the right people. It's more than just are they willing to run the program at a school but will they give the right amount of organization and mentoring. You want to hit that Golilocks zone of not mentoring too little or too much.

All of the FLL teams (3-5 per year) our FRC team runs are coached by the FRC students. I'm the adult overseeing those high school coaches but the student coaches handle all the day to day activities of their FLL teams. Those teams meet twice a week in the fall for 1.7 hours per day. This is great for the younger kids but also great leadership training for the high school students.

Our rule in the Lego lab is that coaches never touch the robot nor the keyboard. They are there to keep the students on task and lead brainstorming sessions. They ask probing questions, not deliver answers.

If running the teams with your high school students isn't practical, focus on finding adults who are good with kids. That could be teachers but is just as likely to be parents. Many teachers these days are over-worked and are reluctant to add one more thing. The most important point is that the kids have fun. FLL can be a great experience but it can also be worse than not doing it at all with the wrong coach or team. A lot depends on the coach and making sure the kids who are in it really want to be there.

Financially, we usually charge the parents a fee to cover expenses and then have scholarships for those who can't afford it. That would depend on the demographics in your area. No matter what it will be cheaper than daycare.

There will be a significant up front expense buying Lego or Vex parts. You'll have Lego parts and FIRST registration / field kits for each FLL team. FLL costs a minimum of $800 per team the first year. It's less from that point on because you'll have the Lego kits. In my opinion a single kit is good up to about four kids per team. You'll wish you had another Lego kit even at four students but bigger than that it gets very important because there won't be enough for everyone to do otherwise. The software kids will be constantly waiting for the mechanical kids who are waiting for the software kids. In any event don't let FLL teams get bigger than 6 members. FIRST will let you have 10 kids on a FLL team but there really isn't enough for them to do. Much boredom and distraction will ensue.

The way we run FLL, with a light coaching touch, means that we start it in 6th grade. Younger students do FLL all the time but developmentally they will need a lot more handholding. That can easily lead to coach over-involvement. You'll see teams of fourth graders at FLL tournaments with robots that look like a Lego master builder constructed them. That means some well-meaning adult got sucked in and was overly involved. Maybe the judges will catch it and maybe not.

If you have other questions, let me know.

[Lance5136]

Funding multiple teams in one area (and finding enough mentors) is especially tough in a rural community like ours. 5136 has approached this by starting a foundation for FLL, FTC & FRC teams that need support in our valley community. Sponsors have a choice to A. Donate to one specific team (this is more for parents), B. Donate to more robotics programs than just FIRST, and C. , donate to the foundation as a whole for all of the local FIRST teams on a non-biased money-need basis. At first we were going to help out other teams with a booster club like yours, but we realized that we would need a simpler process than going through al of our school's strict money guidelines. We also realized that for sponsors (and all of FIRST), the monetary impact shouldn't just affect one team, but an entire community. Some elementary and middle school teams have already expressed more interest because of the foundation. It makes funding a lot easier, but setting a foundation up requires commitment & knowledge with all of the government regulations.

[treffk]

Funding can be an issue but you can find some dedicated coaches who pay for everything themselves. My mother's FLL teams are this way. Since they were created for my brother in 2008, she had paid for everything the only thing she has asked parents to contribute for is tshirts. I cannot remember exact costs for FLL and for some reason I cannot find the sample budget, but another option would be to divide the cost among the students or the cost remaining after a small grant/sponsorship. After the first year/purchase of the Mindstorm/EV3 the costs go down greatly.

Community teams are wonderful as you do not have to find a sponsor within the school. It also means you do not have to reject/deny students from outside the school district.

If you need any assistance with FLL you can always send me a message. I have volunteered with FLL from 2008-2013 and assisted with coaching for 3 of those years. I stopped because I moved and haven't been able to volunteer in my new home yet.