pic: Swerve again, for fun

[JesseK]

Originally Posted by Bryce2471

What makes you say that? Do you know the weight?

...

We can presume that Kevin from 2451 has a pretty good guess for how much it weighs when he says

It has to be the most compact and lightest swerve to date!

due to

Originally Posted by Aren_Hill

Showed this to Kevin on 2451 and he took off running and now has a fancy 2 speed version.

[Cash4587]

Just curious, is there any way we can get our hands on the CAD files to take a closer look at the module? I know this may be a stretch but worth a shot too: If a team wanted to build this, would the spec sheet include all the parts that come together to make this?

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by asid61

+1. I have a swerve design exactly like this on my computer, except with a 2" colson instead of a 3.25" versawheel, ad it weighs a minimum of 5.3lbs. Still heavier than Bryce's swerve, albeit only very slightly.
Plus, making it into a shifting version requires a lot of weight unless you don't use a COTS shifter shaft.

EDIT: Of course, if anybody could make the design lighter it would be Aren. So it could be lighter actually.

Very nice swerve Aren. It's cool seeing your drives. Are you using a dead axle? Is it possible to flip the cim?

I don't think theoretical weights are fair to compare. If the system isn't made and working, it doesn't matter how light it is.

I could go design a 4 lb swerve now, no guarantee it will work or hold up. Many of the recent designs posted aren't robust enough to survive a season (I think Aren's here would though, as he's fielded 5+ swerves at this point I think).

[Kevin Ainsworth]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

I don't think theoretical weights are fair to compare. If the system isn't made and working, it doesn't matter how light it is.

I could go design a 4 lb swerve now, no guarantee it will work or hold up. Many of the recent designs posted aren't robust enough to survive a season (I think Aren's here would though, as he's fielded 5+ swerves at this point I think).

Couldn't have said it better.

[Tyler2517]

I have to ask were some of the concepts for this taken from my teams designs i posted over the summer? Looks really clean and well thought out.

http://imgur.com/a/H6Qcm

[asid61]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

I don't think theoretical weights are fair to compare. If the system isn't made and working, it doesn't matter how light it is.

I could go design a 4 lb swerve now, no guarantee it will work or hold up. Many of the recent designs posted aren't robust enough to survive a season (I think Aren's here would though, as he's fielded 5+ swerves at this point I think).

We're looking at a theoretical model right now, so it makes sense to compare theoretical weights. Kevin's theoretical weight for his shifting design posted a few months ago was ~7lbs IIRC, whereas Bryce's models for shifting designs weighed around 6.3lbs. Even if it wouldn't survive a season as in the CAD, there's at least 0.5lbs to play with to buff it up. And Kevin's design used only small steel miter gears, whereas this design uses much larger steel bevel gears.
Given that, I think it's possible that this weighs more than many designs posted previously. However, it is much more compact, and for many situations that can be more valued than the weight.

If you believed that none of the recent designs can survive the season, then you really should have said so ealier, when those designs were posted.

Also, I found this yesterday:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/34178
So Aren beat himself some years ago.

EDIT: How is the bevel gear constrained axially on the shaft? Does it depend on the wheel to position itself properly?

[Gdeaver]

This years game was hard on our swerve modules but they are still going strong. I would pick a robust module over a cute light weight module any day. So I say to those who have caded all those modules in the off season, Make them and beat them. Do they perform and survive? Then it is a good design. Until then it's just a concept. We made a CVT module this off season. Do we do it this year? I don't know. I'm leery of adding complexity to an already complex system. I guess it depends on the game. But, we made it and tested it. Made revisions and beat it. First has become brutal. Will 2015 continue this trend?

[Kevin Ainsworth]

Originally Posted by asid61

We're looking at a theoretical model right now, so it makes sense to compare theoretical weights. Kevin's theoretical weight for his shifting design posted a few months ago was ~7lbs IIRC, whereas Bryce's models for shifting designs weighed around 6.3lbs. Even if it wouldn't survive a season as in the CAD, there's at least 0.5lbs to play with to buff it up. And Kevin's design used only small steel miter gears, whereas this design uses much larger steel bevel gears.
Given that, I think it's possible that this weighs more than many designs posted previously. However, it is much more compact, and for many situations that can be more valued than the weight.

If you believed that none of the recent designs can survive the season, then you really should have said so ealier, when those designs were posted.

Also, I found this yesterday:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/34178
So Aren beat himself some years ago.

EDIT: How is the bevel gear constrained axially on the shaft? Does it depend on the wheel to position itself properly?

The larger gear in Aren's design might be larger but the smaller gear is much smaller. I would go off tooth size and not OD of the largest gear.

Our actual module weighs in at 7.5 lbs with no additional lightening of the gears, etc. This is too be expected since all the steel screws weren't added to the CAD model. We'll post a video of it driving around just as soon as it is, should have it powered up this afternoon.

[asid61]

Originally Posted by Kevin Ainsworth

The larger gear in Aren's design might be larger but the smaller gear is much smaller. I would go off tooth size and not OD of the largest gear.

Our actual module weighs in at 7.5 lbs with no additional lightening of the gears, etc. This is too be expected since all the steel screws weren't added to the CAD model. We'll post a video of it driving around just as soon as it is, should have it powered up this afternoon.

The smaller gear is probably 15t or 18t compared to the 20/40 combo I use in my modules, but I don't know for sure. I tend to use 1 module gears (about 24 pitch) for my stuff.
The weight comes not only from the teeth but the face of the gear I think, as well as the hub. As the diameter of the gear increases the area/ volume of the gear increases considerably.

You actually made your module? Super cool! I'll be looking forward to seeing it driving.

[Kyler Hagler]

Great looking swerve Aren!

When you get it working Kevin, it would be awesome to see a video of it working!

[Dillon Carey]

Originally Posted by asid61

Also, I found this yesterday:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/34178
So Aren beat himself some years ago.

Not everything that 1625 has ever done was designed by Aren, many things were, but his senior year on our team was 2008. He helped out up till about 2011, he moved on to help 3928 and 148 after. He did a lot for our team, but their were (and are) a lot of talented people who deserve credit for 1625s success.

Example: I led the design on this module as well as the 2010 6 wheel swerve.

[Aren_Hill]

Originally Posted by Dillon Carey

Not everything that 1625 has ever done was designed by Aren, many things were, but his senior year on our team was 2008. He helped out up till about 2011, he moved on to help 3928 and 148 after. He did a lot for our team, but their were (and are) a lot of talented people who deserve credit for 1625s success.

Example: I led the design on this module as well as the 2010 6 wheel swerve.

^Dillon is the guy who did half the stuff I get credit for, cause Internet.

(And if I made that tiny module, the lightening pattern would've been way cooler looking )

[asid61]

Originally Posted by Dillon Carey

Not everything that 1625 has ever done was designed by Aren, many things were, but his senior year on our team was 2008. He helped out up till about 2011, he moved on to help 3928 and 148 after. He did a lot for our team, but their were (and are) a lot of talented people who deserve credit for 1625s success.

Example: I led the design on this module as well as the 2010 6 wheel swerve.

OMG I'm so sorry. I didn't double check the author.
How did 6 wheel swerve work out?

[pwnageNick]

Originally Posted by asid61

OMG I'm so sorry. I didn't double check the author.
How did 6 wheel swerve work out?

Went to Einstein allied with 2056 and 3138

also:

Finalists at GKC along with Engineering Excellence,

Semi-Finalists at Midwest along with Regional Chairman's

Galileo Division Champions

Never ranked lower than 3rd after quals at any regional or champs, overall season record of 36-13-1

sooooooo...

*Fun fact, only 6-Wheel Swerve to ever be on Einstein

[Chris is me]

Aren never ceases to break my head with his designs. The non-coaxial power transfer is so cool. I like how you use the 16-style bearing thing to avoid using any shafting at all holding the module up. I like how your crazy ideas make complete sense in terms of the problems you're trying to solve.

It doesn't look like you have any sensor feedback on the wheel (velocity, you have a thing for angle i think). Do you have something planned for that? This seems like a cool application for that on-CIM encoder that's been going around CD these days.

If you believed that none of the recent designs can survive the season, then you really should have said so ealier, when those designs were posted.

He's not objecting to the designs, he's objecting to comparing the weight of untested CAD models. He had no reason to make this point until this happened, so I don't think it's a fair criticism.