Making sure EVERY Team can do Auto

[EdWard3637]

One worry with the container set is that it's probably not worth it if there's a chance you can knock over the container by pushing it over the ramp or something.

Also we need to get word out to as many teams as possible whatever consensus is reached about the "standard" autonomous.

A collaborative STACKED TOTE SET is much more difficult than a collaborative CONTAINER SET. Some standard procedures should be created for different situations.

Robot A moves Tote A to the Landmark, Robot B moves Tote B to the landmark and places it on top of Tote A, Robot C moves Tote C to the landmark and places it on top of Tote C. Once a robot places their tote they move out of the way.

Or perhaps

Robot A holds Tote A over the landmark, Robot B moves Tote B to the landmark, Robot A puts Tote A down on Tote B and picks up the stack, Robot C moves Tote C under the stack and moves away, Robot A puts the stack on Tote C and moves away.

Depending on robot design, the best procedure changes, so we need a master protocol for which STACKED TOTE SET procedure should be used.

[Abhishek R]

Originally Posted by ENeyman

My thinking is that since auton this year is so dependent on your other two alliance partners, maybe it's more worth it to try to score some gray totes and get your alliance some "for-sure" points.

You know, I'm curious as to why FIRST wants us to make a "tote set" to score any points. Why can't the points be split among each tote (i.e one tote gets 7 points, two totes gets 14, 3 totes gets 21)? This just seems to penalize an alliance so much...like, I don't even see any point to it. This just forces an all or nothing methodology and really hurts teams who are able to push one over to the zone but their alliance partners can't do so.

[Dancin103]

Originally Posted by Jacob Bendicksen

Seems like it wouldn't be a bad idea to have sample LabView, Java, and C++ code on a flash drive that alliance members (and other teams, for that matter) can copy over before a match.

This is a great idea - even putting it on CD...

[Arhowk]

Originally Posted by Dancin103

This is a great idea - even putting it on CD...

it wouldn't be that hard to type in the pits

public void autonomousInit(){
if(!autonThread.isAlive()) autonThread.start();
autonThread.notify();
}
Thread autonThread = new Thread(){
public void run(){
while(true){
try{
    robotDrive.arcadeDrive(1,0);
    sleep(5000);
    robotDrive.arcadeDrive(0,0);
sleep(Integer.MAX_VALUE);
}catch(Exception ex){
}
}
}

sorry for the indenting but i dd it in like 30 seconds in the text editor

e/ my bad some syntax mistakes

[wilderbuchanan]

Why is there tracking tape on the crates if there is no reason that i can think to use it other than the "landmark" idea

[Arhowk]

Originally Posted by wilderbuchanan

Why is there tracking tape on the crates if there is no reason that i can think to use it other than the "landmark" idea

Conformity. We've had tape for the past few years so...

[John Retkowski]

Originally Posted by EdWard3637

One worry with the container set is that it's probably not worth it if there's a chance you can knock over the container by pushing it over the ramp or something.

Who ever said you had to place the container upright in auto or more importantly teleop for that matter?
Though you wouldn't want it to fall over off the ramp if it caused your bot to lose the game piece.

[EdWard3637]

Originally Posted by John Retkowski

Who ever said you had to place the container upright in auto or more importantly teleop for that matter.

In general, you won't want to a fallen container if you didn't intend to knock it over, and putting it right side up may not be a feature of many robots.

[Elius_Linkus]

Originally Posted by EdWard3637

One worry with the container set is that it's probably not worth it if there's a chance you can knock over the container by pushing it over the ramp or something.

Also we need to get word out to as many teams as possible whatever consensus is reached about the "standard" autonomous.

A collaborative STACKED TOTE SET is much more difficult than a collaborative CONTAINER SET. Some standard procedures should be created for different situations.

Robot A moves Tote A to the Landmark, Robot B moves Tote B to the landmark and places it on top of Tote A, Robot C moves Tote C to the landmark and places it on top of Tote C. Once a robot places their tote they move out of the way.

Or perhaps

Robot A holds Tote A over the landmark, Robot B moves Tote B to the landmark, Robot A puts Tote A down on Tote B and picks up the stack, Robot C moves Tote C under the stack and moves away, Robot A puts the stack on Tote C and moves away.

Depending on robot design, the best procedure changes, so we need a master protocol for which STACKED TOTE SET procedure should be used.

A CONTAINER SET doesn't require the bins to be upright, just fully contained in the auto-zone. Even if you're behind the scoring platform, It' shouldn't be hard, even for a robot without any sort of pickup mechanism, to push the container forward a metre or two (admittedly, there is some worry about a tipped bin rolling out of the zone, but still, a bot without a pick-up mechanism could have a wedge shape on their robot, something to nest the bin and keep it from moving around too much.)

As for all of the bots interacting with the totes, I doubt all bots will have the capability to find the totes once they've been moved, unless every FRC team programs Autons that place the crates in exactly the same place, not just somewhere on the landmark. What would happen if the tote is slightly disoriented? Or one robot isn't out of the way when the other goes to make a stack? Trying for inter-robot interaction in Autonomous seems nearly impossible, or at least hellishly difficult, and definitely something very few teams are going to do. The best plan might be to have a few Autonomous programs that can be changed match to match (checkbox on the dashboard perhaps.) Something simple, like pushing a bin into the auto-zone, and possibly something more complex. Alliances can select who will be doing what before each match starts, and everyone could check the corresponding box when they set up. Would seem much simpler than trying to coordinate any sort of tote pass-off between robots.

[John Retkowski]

Originally Posted by EdWard3637

In general, you won't want to a fallen container if you didn't intend to knock it over, and putting it right side up may not be a feature of many robots.

I originally thought the same, but our team has been running some tests and sideways containers stacked on top of totes are surprisingly stable up to a point.

That being said, I predict there being alot of knocked over containers between getting the four in the center on each side, and stacks getting knocked over in teleop. Teams might want to consider/reconsider being able to pickup containers in multiple orientations.

[EdWard3637]

Can it at least be agreed that there are various standard routines that teams should attempt to run/create a dashboard option to run? My examples were just examples.

There should be collaboration across the FRC community on the various auton procedures that are most important to have.

[Arhowk]

Originally Posted by EdWard3637

Can it at least be agreed that there are various standard routines that teams should attempt to run/create a dashboard option to run? My examples were just examples.

There should be collaboration across the FRC community on the various auton procedures that are most important to have.

Simply put, this won't happen. Thinking realistically, if this was attempted, I can't see more than 3 teams following the standard at kettering. This really distinguishes the best of the best programmers; those who can create a static set to pickup and set the boxes in a predefined way or those that can adapt in according to their alliance's robots.

[cglrcng]

I commend the group of you even posting the ideas to work together (and help others in their auto programming), and put forth the effort to help others help themselves and you....The points will matter to everyone given the QA...But, the help of those teams that cannot get there easily on their own in auto especially, will be much more rewarding to the entire FRC community as a whole. Good to see the outlook.

[dellagd]

Originally Posted by Gregor

Prediction. No team will stack a yellow tote in autonomous on top of a tote already moved (other than a small brush) by another team.

*Now another MAR team accept it too and we're golden

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by dellagd

*Now another MAR team accept it too and we're golden

Ditto, but for Texas.